From douglas Tue May 11 14:56:54 1999 From: douglas (Doug Schuler) Date: Tue, 11 May 1999 14:56:54 -0700 (PDT) Subject: COMMUNICATIONS, COMMUNITY AND DEMOCRACY: How Are They Linked? Message-ID: <199905112156.OAA09079@scn.org> This sounds GREAT!! -- Doug --- please distribute to interested people --- COMMUNITY POWERED RADIO CPR**308 27th Ave. E.**Seattle, WA**98112 cpr at gurlmail.com FOR IMMEDIATE RELEASE Contact: Sheri Herndon 633 1987 COMMUNICATIONS, COMMUNITY AND DEMOCRACY: How Are They Linked? Alan Korn, the premier attorney on microradio will be speaking at Seattle Central Community College, Room 4601 on Thursday, May 13 at 7 p.m. There will also be a screening of the award-winning documentary, "Fear & Favor in the Newsroom". Alan Korn is an attorney with the National Lawyers Guild Committee on Democratic Communications (CDC) and is on the steering committee of the Microradio Empowerment Coalition. Mr. Korn has worked with the CDC on microradio issues throughout the 1990s, and he is the author of the initial legal arguments used by Mbanna Kantako, Stephen Dunifer, and others challenging the Federal Communications Commission 's ban on low power community radio. Because of the courtroom victories in the Free Radio Berkeley case and the continued electronic civil disobedience of microradio broadcasters around the country, the FCC is now considering a proposal to create a legalized low power FM radio service. Mr. Korn will discuss the history and strategy of the microradio movement and explain why public comment is urgently needed to avoid the many flaws in the FCC's low power FM proposal. He'll also talk about the role of democratic and independent media in our local communities. Mr. Korn is also an arts and entertainment attorney and has lectured extensively on copyright law issues and authored a monthly column on legal issues for musicians. He appears in the documentary film, "Sonic Outlaws", by Craig Baldwin (1995) addressing fair use issues arising at the intersection of copyright law, free speech, and contemporary artistic expression. There will also be a screening of a segment of the film, "Fear and Favor in the News Room", an award winning expos� of corporate media. Directors Beth Sanders and Randy Baker will be present to introduce their film, which was banned by PBS's national distributor. This event is being sponsored by Community Powered Radio. CPR is a Seattle-based organization formed in 1998 to educate people about media democracy and literacy issues and to support grassroots groups in the creation of their own media. Our current campaign is to promote noncommercial low powered radio in the Pacific Northwest. * * * * * * * * * * * * * * From the Listowner * * * * * * * * * * * * . To unsubscribe from this list, send a message to: majordomo at scn.org In the body of the message, type: unsubscribe scn ==== Messages posted on this list are also available on the web at: ==== * * * * * * * http://www.scn.org/volunteers/scn-l/ * * * * * * * From steve at advocate.net Wed May 12 17:11:07 1999 From: steve at advocate.net (Steve) Date: Wed, 12 May 1999 16:11:07 -0800 Subject: Copyright Message-ID: <199905122313.QAA02653@scn.org> x-no-archive: yes ========================= Copyright Protection Is for Dinosaurs by Stewart Alsop (excerpts) Why do we need to protect intellectual property? Seriously, I'm beginning to wonder if we really need government protection of intellectual property in our new cyberworld. Copyrights. Trademarks. Patents. The basic idea behind these three concepts is to provide a kind of legal monopoly that safeguards the results of creative effort as an incentive for people to engage in that effort. The theory, at least in most Western nations, is that people will not be motivated to produce such effort if the results can be copied freely. I'm going to deal with copyright, as it's the principle nearest to my heart-- I've spent most of my career as a journalist and editor profiting from my own or my employers' copyrights. Copyright protection evolves from a world in which copying can be prevented. No one would have even considered this slightly screwy idea--let's prevent people from copying other people's work--if it had never been possible to prevent copying. But now we live in a new world where copying is next to impossible to stop. Indeed, copying is so easy that perhaps a government-enforced monopoly on creative efforts doesn't make sense anymore. There was a time, from about 1980 to 1986 or so, when PC software companies were concerned about users copying programs from one floppy disk to another. These companies resorted to "disk protection" schemes, which were programming that made it impossible to copy software unless you were a proficient hacker. But this protection also made the software more difficult to use, and customers complained. After a few years the companies figured out that they could remove the disk-protection schemes without harm. They discovered that they could still get customers to pay for manuals, customer service, and other benefits, and still make lots of money. For eight years, from 1985 to 1993, I produced a newsletter called P.C. Letter. I printed copies on paper and mailed them in envelopes to subscribers. My subscribers, of course, could easily photocopy the material and send it to colleagues. That mattered to me, since I was charging $500 a year for subscriptions. Indeed, many newsletter publishers still consider photocopying a big legal issue. But the truth is that photocopying was a great sales tool, because prospects were more likely to subscribe if they had read an issue or two and knew that a colleague was not only reading the newsletter but also getting it first since he'd paid for a subscription. So I never made a big deal out of photocopying. Instead, I sold subscriptions as aggressively as I could, in part by emphasizing the benefits of having your own copy. No one has paid any attention whatsoever to my proposed remedy for dealing with Microsoft's allegedly anticompetitive behavior. I proposed that if we believe that we citizens of the U.S. can't control or regulate Microsoft's behavior as a monopoly, then let's withdraw government protection of the intellectual property making that monopoly possible. In other words, take away copyright and trademark protection for Microsoft products deemed to be monopolies--Microsoft Windows 98, for instance, and perhaps Microsoft Office, but not Windows NT or Windows CE. This would probably spur competition. Other software makers have been reluctant to create an alternate version of Windows primarily because of the threat of having Microsoft sue them. Smart people: Microsoft would have an excellent case if anyone tried to copy Windows or Office. Remove the government-approved monopoly, however, and you'd still have some pretty phenomenal obstacles that would, in effect, protect Microsoft. First, there's the technical challenge of reproducing the Windows programming interface so successfully that Sun Windows, for instance, would run all the programs that run on Microsoft Windows. Then there's the sheer speed of change- -as soon as a competitor had managed to reproduce Windows 98, say, Microsoft would be out with a new version. Most important, although Microsoft is considered a Darth Vader because of its business practices, the truth is that users wouldn't trust anyone else to make Windows work. Trust is so significant in technical matters that it means more than it ever used to, and is now a true barrier to entry for competitors. Meanwhile, whole industries are arising around unprotected content and ideas. Linux is an operating system that isn't owned by anyone and so can be freely copied and revised. A bunch of companies, including Red Hat Software of Research Triangle Park, N.C., and LinuxCare of San Francisco, are building businesses that charge not for the product but for service in support of the product. Most recently, you might have heard about this thing called MP3. It's a new way to store music in digital form. Just like Linux, music in MP3 format can be freely copied. Nothing in the format protects the rights of the artist or music company. Needless to say, the recorded-music business is in an uproar. How can you make any money, it asks, if people can just make copies of the songs they want, attach them to an e-mail message, and send them to 50 or 500 friends? How indeed? Well, I've seen business plans for at least three companies that are planning to answer that question by building businesses around unprotected music. I can't get into details because these plans are still floating around, but one thing's for sure--the same thing will happen to film once hard disks and network connections get big enough to handle digital video as easily as current equipment handles digital music. So here we are, at the dawn of virtual reality, electronic commerce, and digital information. Doesn't it begin to feel as if we should go back and reexamine our assumptions about whether creative effort should be protected by the government? Stewart Alsop is a partner with New Enterprise Associates, a venture capital firm. * * * * * * * * * * * * * * From the Listowner * * * * * * * * * * * * . To unsubscribe from this list, send a message to: majordomo at scn.org In the body of the message, type: unsubscribe scn ==== Messages posted on this list are also available on the web at: ==== * * * * * * * http://www.scn.org/volunteers/scn-l/ * * * * * * * From steve at advocate.net Thu May 13 11:59:06 1999 From: steve at advocate.net (Steve) Date: Thu, 13 May 1999 10:59:06 -0800 Subject: Email and politics Message-ID: <199905131801.LAA05269@scn.org> x-no-archive: yes ======================== Do e-mail petitions work? Chain letters and spam rarely impress politicians -- but they might listen to a more personal breed of Web activism. Katherine Hobson Salon.com 5/10/99 You've probably received an e-mail petition protesting a proposal to cut Congressional funding for public broadcasting and the arts. In fact, you've likely received it more than once. What you may not know is that it has been making the rounds since 1995, when two University of Northern Colorado freshmen -- who, like most people at the time, were new to the Internet -- e-mailed it to their friends. Recipients were supposed to tack on their names, pass it along and -- after every 50th signature -- forward a copy to the authors. The petition snowballed, and not in a good way. The university's server was inundated with replies, many of them venomous. "A lot of people consider those things spam," says a programmer at the university's information services department, who asked not to be identified. "There were a lot of suggestions as to what to do with the creators, most of them not very kind." The pair's frosh mistake was to presume that flooding e-mail inboxes with a well-intentioned petition would be well received. But as this ceaselessly circulating petition and many others have shown, e-mail activism doesn't always have a WD-40 effect on the wheels of participatory democracy: It backfires as often as it succeeds. The secret to making online activism effective seems to be knowing when to turn to e-mail and what to use it for. There is, of course, a distinction to be made between using e-mail to communicate and using it to reproduce spam-like petitions. Chain letters have proven themselves to be fairly useless; more sophisticated petitions, posted to a Web site that collects signatures, have garnered more respect. Plenty of people argue that e-mail simply doesn't lend itself direct communication between the people and their representatives. "You want to make noise as an advocate -- you want the walls to shake," says Jonah Seiger, co-founder of Mindshare Internet Campaigns, a Washington new-media political consulting firm. "E-mail has no weight, no mass. It comes in quietly." Seiger says e-mail is best used by an organization to communicate with its members. "It's the single most important tool in its ability to keep people informed and keep them interested in something," he says. Groups ranging from the World Wildlife Federation to the National Rifle Association have e-mail action alert lists, and many provide standardized letters on hot-button issues that can be edited and then sent to members of Congress by e-mail or fax. But some groups say e-mail's uses go beyond information and mobilization -- it can also bring concrete results. The U.S. Public Interest Research Group (U.S. PIRG) uses e-mail to rally support for its Arctic wilderness campaign. The effort aims to prevent oil drilling in the Arctic National Wildlife Refuge, which the group claims is the only area along Alaska's north slope not open for oil and gas drilling. By urging university students to e-mail British Petroleum, ARCO and Chevron (Exxon, as far as U.S. PIRG can tell, has no public e-mail address) and ask them to cancel their drilling plans, the group has sparked three separate waves of e-mail protest. "We got their attention and held it," says Athan Manuel, director of the campaign. A month after the first Arctic action day, the group got a call from BP, its biggest target, he says. "We've met with them three or four times now, and each time, we met with someone more and more senior -- the last meeting was even with someone who was British! That was a first." Web-based petitions, too, have shown an ability to harness public sentiment and support. A petition protesting the Communications Decency Act in 1995 collected 115,000 signatures, according to Seiger. He helped organize both the petition and the related "black page protest," in which many Web sites went dark to demonstrate opposition to the law. More recently, the Censure and Move On campaign -- founded by Joan Blades and her husband Web Boyd -- used a Web-based petition to urge Congress to formally admonish President Clinton and get on with its business, gathering 500,000 signatures along the way. Move On also used e-mail to direct people to the site, asking interested parties to send it only to friends and not spam indiscriminately. "E-mail is a unique way for people to be involved directly," says Blades, adding that the Web-based model works best for single issues that attract a broad range of participants. The Move On site now features a new Littleton, Colo.-inspired petition, asking visitors to add their names in support of the idea that it is time for government to accept its proper role in regulating firearms. Web-based petitions work because they have the potential to channel protest to the most appropriate recipient, the sender's representative or senator, says Chris Casey, a Congressional staffer and author of "The Hill on the Net: Congress Enters the Information Age." That's key, since a recent study shows that most members of Congress don't pay attention to e-mail from outside the home district. (Many legislators don't post their e-mail addresses and some, like Dick Armey, have introduced elaborate forms to ensure that their only communication is with their own constituents.) Meanwhile, other groups have discovered Web-based activism. Visitors to Families USA can sign a petition urging their congressperson to enact a patient's bill of rights. At the June 4 site (named for the date of the Tiananmen Square massacre), visitors can add their names to a petition protesting China's human rights record that will be delivered to Chinese President Jiang Zemin, U.N. Secretary General Kofi Annan and U.N. High Commissioner for Human Rights Mary Robinson. And Toledo, Ohio, voters can participate in a movement to recall mayor Carty Finkbeiner -- although the site requires people to print out the petition and physically sign it. "Opportunities in this area are going to continue," predicts Casey. To be sure, it can be hard to pin down the results of online activism. The Communications Decency Act ultimately passed Congress (it was later ruled unconstitutional by the Supreme Court), while Censure and Move On didn't convince Congress to do either. Though organizers didn't achieve their political goals, they say they did have an impact. Blades of Move On concedes that the petition got very little direct feedback from Congress, but as signatures started coming in, it seemed to bolster the Democrats to speak up against impeachment. Move On also attracted $13.2 million in campaign contributions, and volunteers pledged to spend a total of 750,000 hours supporting candidates who oppose those who voted for impeachment. Meanwhile, Congress is getting more receptive to e-mail. A 1998 Bonner & Associates/American University survey of 270 Congressional offices showed that 90 percent of the offices used e-mail, with most of the others planning to do so within a year. Sen. Patrick Leahy (D-Vt.), who co-founded and co-heads the bipartisan Congressional Internet Caucus, pays attention to electronic messages. "He's put e-mail on par with phone and mail messages," says Leahy's spokesman David Carle. But not everyone is so inclined. When considering a policy position, most Congressional offices give the most weight to personal letters, followed by personal visits, telephone calls, faxes, personal e-mails, paper petitions, form letters, postcards and form e-mail, according to a recent study by OMB Watch, a nonprofit group focusing on activities at the Office of Management and Budget. Basically, congressional offices don't give equal weight to preprinted, postage-paid postcards and handwritten, stamped letters, and they apply that same framework to e-mail. "People think, 'Why stop with my own congressperson? I can cc them all!' Somehow they think they have a louder voice if they send it to every member of Congress," says Casey. In fact, legislators treat such spam-like messages the same way we all do. Sites that use the "click here and e-mail every member of the U.S. Senate" aren't effective, adds Casey, and "e-mail sent to everyone in Congress is likely to be received by no one." To be counted, send it to a single member -- either your own representative or a committee head responsible for a particular issue. "E-mail, done right, has every expectation of being received and responded to," he says. That response will still likely come by regular mail. And just 15 percent of the Congressional offices surveyed use e-mail to keep constituents up-to-date on issues that may be important to them, according to the Bonner/American University study. Casey is optimistic that e-mail and other forms of electronic democracy are increasing participation, saying that there's no indication that phone and letter contacts are going down. But he urges people to think beyond the confines of e-mail petitions. When e-mail doesn't provoke an anti-spam rage, or generate petition fatigue, it can give people a false sense of having done something worthwhile. "People end up feeling that they've had a voice," he says. "In fact, they've been misled." E-mail activism actually follows the common-sense rules that govern most communications. It can be effective -- but only when the medium is used respectfully, by one individual or group making a sincere attempt to share ideas with another. salon.com | May 10, 1999 About the writer: Katherine Hobson is a staff reporter for TheStreet.com and a freelance writer in New York. Copyright c 1999 Salon Internet Inc. * * * * * * * * * * * * * * From the Listowner * * * * * * * * * * * * . To unsubscribe from this list, send a message to: majordomo at scn.org In the body of the message, type: unsubscribe scn ==== Messages posted on this list are also available on the web at: ==== * * * * * * * http://www.scn.org/volunteers/scn-l/ * * * * * * * From douglas Fri May 14 09:49:33 1999 From: douglas (Doug Schuler) Date: Fri, 14 May 1999 09:49:33 -0700 (PDT) Subject: Upcoming event ... in Olympia Message-ID: <199905141649.JAA08054@scn.org> Steve Cisler, formerly of Apple and currently on the Association For Community Networking board will be speaking this coming Wednesday evening in Olympia. It would be great if you could make it. -- Doug FOR IMMEDIATE RELEASE ---------------------------------------------------- -- please forward to appropriate lists and people -- ---------------------------------------------------- Plato Royalty Technology Lecture Series The Evergreen State College Free public presentation MAY 19, 1999 Digital Networks & Analog Cultures: Renaissance or Culture-Killer? A Presentation by Steve Cisler Association For Community Networks For many people, the Internet represents the most powerful way to obtain the information they need quickly and inexpensively. For others it represents the ultimate expression in globalization, an unwelcome and intruding force capable of destroying cultures by flooding in too much information too quickly from the outside world. At the same time many cultures not associated with high-tech are embracing the Internet. How do traditional cultures use the Internet? What conflicts and controversies emerge regarding this new medium? What forces are at play in the development of new systems worldwide? On May 19th, from 7-9 PM, in Lecture Hall 1 at The Evergreen State College, former Apple Computer Librarian Steve Cisler, will report on his experiences working with people in the international community as well as with native groups and other people in the U.S. For over a decade, Steve has worked as an astute observer and advocate for non commercial communication systems. First, as a librarian at Apple and manager of the 'Apple Library of Tomorrow ' program and, most recently, as a founder of the Association For Community Networking, Steve's research has promoted an understanding of the uses (and abuses) of computer networking development. Notably his work has often touched societies and cultural settings where one is unlikely to encounter the "typical" computer user. Recognized as a leader in this area, Steve recently edited a special section on "Indigenous Cultures and the Internet" for the magazine Cultural Survival. To learn more about his ground-breaking work, join us for Steve Cisler's provocative presentation. His pursuits have taken him to the Second Luddite Congress, the Tactical Media conference in Amsterdam, the Internet Society and the American Library Association conferences among others. The Plato Lecture series is made possible by royalties from Evergreen student and faculty software development. This lecture is sponsored by the Community, Communication, and Computers program at the Evergreen State College. For more information on this program or the lecture, please contact Rebecca Chamberlain, 360.866.6000 x 6844, or Doug Schuler 360.866.6000 x 6704, . * * * * * * * * * * * * * * From the Listowner * * * * * * * * * * * * . To unsubscribe from this list, send a message to: majordomo at scn.org In the body of the message, type: unsubscribe scn ==== Messages posted on this list are also available on the web at: ==== * * * * * * * http://www.scn.org/volunteers/scn-l/ * * * * * * * From kurt at grogatch.seaslug.org Sat May 15 00:05:36 1999 From: kurt at grogatch.seaslug.org (Kurt Cockrum) Date: Sat, 15 May 1999 00:05:36 -0700 Subject: John Zerzan in town Message-ID: <199905150705.AAA16421@grogatch.seaslug.org> This will be of interest to those who have a critical interest in technology, whether Luddite or technophile... On Sat., 8pm, May 22 `99, John Zerzan, the noted critic of technology, will speak at Left Bank Book Distribution, 1004 Turner Way East, Seattle `112 (info: 322-2868 or 622-0195). The venue is close to 23rd Ave. E. & E. Aloha. Zerzan is the author of the essay collection "Elements of Resistance" (Left Bank Books, Seattle, 1988). The event is sponsored by Left Bank Books, 92 Pike St., Seattle. --kurt * * * * * * * * * * * * * * From the Listowner * * * * * * * * * * * * . To unsubscribe from this list, send a message to: majordomo at scn.org In the body of the message, type: unsubscribe scn ==== Messages posted on this list are also available on the web at: ==== * * * * * * * http://www.scn.org/volunteers/scn-l/ * * * * * * * From steve at advocate.net Mon May 17 01:26:13 1999 From: steve at advocate.net (Steve) Date: Mon, 17 May 1999 00:26:13 -0800 Subject: Hmmm Message-ID: <199905170728.AAA10875@scn.org> x-no-archive: yes ========================= Book Review - The Inmates Are Running the Asylum: Why High Tech Products Drive Us Crazy and How To Restore The Sanity, by Alan Cooper Elias Crim IntellectualCapital.com Anyone who has ever had the impulse to smash an annoying piece of electronic equipment will be happy to learn that the "inmates" referred to in the title of Alan Cooper's new book are actually software programmers. And they are in control, lamentably, of one of the most important business functions in the world economy, namely the design and production of software. So argues Cooper, and persuasively at that. Given that almost every tool we put our hands to these days has a chip somewhere in it, Cooper believes this fact of user- hostility is hugely unproductive and even on occasion fatal. Cooper, who is known in the industry as the father of Visual Basic, argues that there is a reason for all the pain, literal and figurative, that software causes us. And that is in the nature of the software creation process itself. Software design must be distinguished from programming, just as architecture is different from construction engineering. The design process is aimed at reaching a particular goal, whereas programming is about implementing the design. A house constructed without an architectural plan might be cheap to build but it might also be difficult to live in. The problems with letting programmers take over significant design responsibilities, argues Cooper, are numerous. First, programmers are typically people absorbed in the engineering process and want it (not the user's experience of the software) to be easy. Asking them to add intelligent interface design as a last stage of the process both lengthens the development process (against enormous pressures in the other direction) and proposes a key step too late in the process for it to be implemented. Second, most software involves a high degree of "cognitive friction," a term coined by Cooper. That is, our experiences using most software make us either an apologist (boasting about how difficult a program was to learn) or a survivor. Cooper calls this survivor mentality the Stockholm syndrome: we hostages tend to fall in love with our captors (the programmers). The result, as Cooper entertainingly describes, is "weird, sullen software" produced by (typically) weird, sullen people. In truth, software programs are as malleable as human speech: they can be rude or friendly. There is no reason why we cannot make our programs more like us, rather than asking us to imitate our machines. Programmers do not really mean any ill: they are simply engineers who often answer the request for more user-friendliness in the way Bill Gates supposedly once did: By offering, in effect, to stamp the phrase "user-friendly" on the outside of the box. This closed mentality is due to the all-encompassing demands of the programming task itself. All his or her attention is focused on the nature and needs of the computer, rather than the nature and needs of the user. The programmer consciously designs the code inside the program (what the program does), all the while almost unconsciously designing the program's interaction with the users (how the program behaves). When programmers think about us at all, we software users are typically viewed as at one of two extremes, Cooper claims. We are either complete novices (as the product marketers quickly assume) or else we are "power users" (as the programmers prefer to see us). The term Cooper suggests as closest to reality would call us "perpetual intermediates." The high-tech industries are in denial of a simple fact: our technology tools are too hard to use. The engineers who make these tools see their power and their rich combination of functions and features. They do not see how difficult to use most of these tools are nor do they see that they are violating the #1 goal of most computers users, as Cooper puts it -- not to feel stupid. We get that feeling because many software tools are built with the ejection-seat lever mixed in with the everyday functions. As a result, a single errant keystroke can have an impact out of all proportion to reality. That is because we rarely design programs with common sense -- i.e. ones that are designed to know when we are asking for an unusual or outlandish result with potentially significant consequences. How did we get here? The main reason is that, despite appearances, business executives are not really in charge of the software development process: the engineers run the asylum. And with software, typically nothing is visible until it is done, meaning that any second-guessing by non-programmers is too late to be effective. So what's the alternative? Cooper offers a design-directed methodology that claims to produce "polite" software. This slightly comic term turns out to mean something important, however. Polite software does not forget things (such as what you were doing with it on the last occasion you used it), nor does it blame the user (forcing you to start over a sequential process because of one misstep). In other words, the emphasis is on how the software behaves toward, communicates with, and informs the user, not just on what the software does for the user. * * * * * * * * * * * * * * From the Listowner * * * * * * * * * * * * . To unsubscribe from this list, send a message to: majordomo at scn.org In the body of the message, type: unsubscribe scn ==== Messages posted on this list are also available on the web at: ==== * * * * * * * http://www.scn.org/volunteers/scn-l/ * * * * * * * From tuanmd at scn.org Tue May 18 09:31:28 1999 From: tuanmd at scn.org (TuanMD) Date: Tue, 18 May 1999 09:31:28 -0700 (PDT) Subject: 10,000 free video that scn.org can get some. Message-ID: I was about to delete everything except the part about free video but I don't want Microsoft sue me as an example for the rest of us. So I paste part of the message that I think of interest to scn below. NEW VIDEO INTRODUCES OLDER ADULTS TO COMPUTERS, 'NET http://www.microsoft.com/presspass/press/1999/May99/MysteryPR.htm As part of Older Americans Month, Microsoft has produced a new educational video that introduces older adults to the basics of computers and the Internet. Microsoft plans to distribute 10,000 copies of the video, free of charge, to nonprofit community organizations throughout the world. ---------- Forwarded message ---------- Date: Tue, 18 May 1999 03:10:30 -0700 From: Microsoft To: tuanmd at scn.org Subject: Exploring Windows(R) News - 1999, Issue No. 10 Exploring Windows(R) News - 1999, Issue No. 10 ---------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe to Exploring Windows simply reply to this message with the word "Unsubscribe" in the subject line. ---------------------------------------------------------------------- VISIT OUR WEB SITES FOR IN-DEPTH INFORMATION ABOUT WINDOWS PRODUCTS Windows Home Page http://www.microsoft.com/windows/ FOR UPDATES TO WINDOWS PRODUCTS, GO TO Windows Update http://www.microsoft.com/windows/downloads/default.asp ---------------------------------------------------------------------- WHAT'S NEW ---------------------------------------------------------------------- WINDOWS 98 SECOND EDITION ON THE WAY http://www.microsoft.com/presspass/press/1999/May99/secondedPR.htm Windows 98 Second Edition will be available this summer. The new version allows PCs on a home network to share a single Web account and adds support for cable modems and DSL, as well as Microsoft(r) Internet Explorer 5, Windows Media(tm) Player 6.2, the latest version of Microsoft NetMeeting(tm) and other features designed to optimize the operating system. ---------------------------------------------------------------------- GET BETTER AUDIO, VIDEO WITH WINDOWS MEDIA(tm) TECHNOLOGIES 4.0 BETA http://www.microsoft.com/windows/dailynews/041499.htm Microsoft announced the first publicly available beta release of Windows Media Technologies 4.0. The major upgrade of the Microsoft streaming media platform offers high-quality audio and video and cuts audio download time in half. ---------------------------------------------------------------------- TRY OUT WINDOWS NETMEETING 3 BETA http://www.microsoft.com/netmeeting/?/netmeeting/Beta30.htm Windows NetMeeting 3 integrates audio, data and videoconferencing into one package that lets you communicate via the Internet. Its data-conferencing features let you draw on a shared whiteboard, send text messages and transfer files. Real-time audio and video features in NetMeeting let you talk to friends and family over the Internet. ---------------------------------------------------------------------- NEW VIDEO INTRODUCES OLDER ADULTS TO COMPUTERS, 'NET http://www.microsoft.com/presspass/press/1999/May99/MysteryPR.htm As part of Older Americans Month, Microsoft has produced a new educational video that introduces older adults to the basics of computers and the Internet. Microsoft plans to distribute 10,000 copies of the video, free of charge, to nonprofit community organizations throughout the world. ---------------------------------------------------------------------- RIDE THE MAGIC SCHOOL BUS INTO THE WORLD OF ANIMALS http://www.microsoft.com/kids/msb/animals.htm Microsoft and Scholastic Entertainment have launched the seventh CD-ROM in their award-winning Magic School Bus(tm) series of educational software for children. The new title is "Scholastic's The Magic School Bus Explores the World of Animals." ---------------------------------------------------------------------- MSN UPDATES ---------------------------------------------------------------------- TRANSPOINT ADDS MORE BANKS http://www.microsoft.com/presspass/press/1999/May99/newbanks.htm TransPoint has added nine banks to its Internet bill delivery and payment pilot. The new banks mean the TransPoint e-bill service is available to even more customers. ---------------------------------------------------------------------- MICROSOFT ACQUIRES WEB-BASED CALENDAR COMPANY http://www.microsoft.com/presspass/press/1999/Apr99/Jumppr.htm Microsoft has agreed to acquire Jump Networks (http://www.jump.com/), a leading provider of Web-based calendar services. Jump's technology enables consumers to access their e-mail, address books and calendars from any Internet-connected computer. The technology will be integrated with MSN(tm). ---------------------------------------------------------------------- SPECIAL OFFERS ---------------------------------------------------------------------- FREE UPDATES FOR HANDHELD PCS RUNNING WINDOWS(r) CE HANDHELD PC PRO http://www.microsoft.com/windowsce/products/download/list.asp Get even more from your Handheld PC with these new free updates: Plus! Pack with tools you'll use every day, and PowerToys for advanced capabilities. Both are optimized for the Windows CE H/PC Pro software. ---------------------------------------------------------------------- TIPS & TRICKS ---------------------------------------------------------------------- INSIDE MICROSOFT WINDOWS 98 TIP OF THE WEEK Brought to you by INSIDE MICROSOFT WINDOWS 98, a monthly publication of ZD Journals. For a FREE issue, go to https://secure.zdjournals.com/w98/cb2000.htm CHANGING ICONS ON THE LINKS TOOLBAR If you're using the Internet Explorer 4.0 Links toolbar to provide quick access to your most often accessed Web sites, you know that each link shows the same icon. Fortunately, you can spice up your Links toolbar by assigning custom icons to each item. To do so, simply right-click on the existing icon and select Properties from the shortcut menu. Then, click the Change Icon button and use the Browse button to locate a file that contains the icon you want, and then double-click on it. ---------------------------------------------------------------------- WUGNET SHAREWARE OF THE WEEK http://www.wugnet.com/shareware/99/week151 Each week WUGNET(r) and Microsoft feature a shareware pick demonstrating the highest standards available today in shareware for Windows 98. This week's pick is Black Hole Organizer, a free-form database that's been designed from the ground up to let you create categories and subcategories (folders) that are meaningful to you. ---------------------------------------------------------------------- ADDITIONAL RESOURCES ---------------------------------------------------------------------- For information on local events and promotions in your area http://microsoft.com/usa/ ---------------------------------------------------------------------- For additional information, visit: Microsoft Daily News http://www.microsoft.com/windows/dailynews!/ ---------------------------------------------------------------------- HOW TO USE THIS MAILING LIST: To unsubscribe to this newsletter, reply to this email with the word "Unsubscribe" in the subject line. Visit our customer Profile Center where you can manage your communications preferences and subscribe to a wide variety of informative newsletters at http://www.microsoft.com/misc/unsubscribe.htm THIS DOCUMENT IS PROVIDED FOR INFORMATIONAL PURPOSES ONLY. The information contained in this document represents the current view of Microsoft Corporation on the issues discussed as of the date of publication. Because Microsoft must respond to change in market conditions, it should not be interpreted to be a commitment on the part of Microsoft and Microsoft cannot guarantee the accuracy of any information presented after the date of publication. INFORMATION PROVIDED IN THIS DOCUMENT IS PROVIDED 'AS IS' WITHOUT WARRANTY OF ANY KIND, EITHER EXPRESS OR IMPLIED, INCLUDING BUT NOT LIMITED TO THE IMPLIED WARRANTIES OF MERCHANTABILITY, FITNESS FOR A PARTICULAR PURPOSE AND FREEDOM FROM INFRINGEMENT. The user assumes the entire risk as to the accuracy and the use of this document. This document may be copied and distributed subject to the following conditions: 1. All text must be copied without modification and all pages must be included 2. All copies must contain Microsoft's copyright notice and any other notices provided therein 3. This document may not be distributed for profit * * * * * * * * * * * * * * From the Listowner * * * * * * * * * * * * . To unsubscribe from this list, send a message to: majordomo at scn.org In the body of the message, type: unsubscribe scn ==== Messages posted on this list are also available on the web at: ==== * * * * * * * http://www.scn.org/volunteers/scn-l/ * * * * * * * From art333 at collegemail.com Mon May 24 01:35:57 1999 From: art333 at collegemail.com (art333 at collegemail.com) Date: Mon, 24 May 1999 01:35:57 Subject: copier & laser printer supplies advertisement Message-ID: <199905240601.XAA15047@scn.org> BENCHMARK PRINT SUPPLY ***LASER PRINTER TONER CARTRIDGES*** ***FAX AND COPIER TONER*** CHECK OUT OUR NEW CARTRIDGE PRICES : APPLE LASER WRITER PRO 600 OR 16/600 $69 LASER WRITER SELECT 300,310.360 $64 LASER WRITER 300, 320, 360 $54 LASER WRITER LS,NT,2NTX,2F,2G & 2SC $54 LASER WRITER 12/640 $79 HEWLETT PACKARD LASERJET SERIES 2,3 & 3D $49 LASERJET SERIES 2P AND 3P $54 LASERJET SERIES 3SI AND 4SI $75 LASERJET SERIES 4L AND 4P $49 LASERJET SERIES 4, 4M, 5, 5M, 4+ $59 LASERJET SERIES 4000 HIGH YIELD $99 LASERJET SERIES 4V $95 LASERJET SERIES 5SI , 8000 $95 LASERJET SERIES 5L AND 6L $49 LASERJET SERIES 5P, 5MP, 6P, 6MP $59 LASERJET SERIES 5000 $89 LASERJET SERIES 1100 $49 LASERJET SERIES 2100 $89 HP LASERFAX LASERFAX 500, 700, FX1, $59 LASERFAX 5000, 7000, FX2, $59 LASERFAX FX3 $69 LASERFAX FX4 $79 LEXMARK OPTRA 4019, 4029 HIGH YIELD $135 OPTRA R, 4039, 4049 HIGH YIELD $135 OPTRA S 4059 HIGH YIELD $135 OPTRA E $59 OPTRA N $115 EPSON EPL-70000, 8000 $105 EPL-1000, 1500 $105 CANON LBP-430 $49 LBP-460, 465 $59 LBP-8 II $54 LBP-LX $54 LBP-MX $95 LBP-AX $49 LBP-EX $59 LBP-SX $49 LBP-BX $95 LBP-PX $49 LBP-WX $95 LBP-VX $59 CANON FAX L700 THRU L790 FX1 $59 CANONFAX L5000 L70000 FX2 $59 CANON COPIERS PC 20, 25 ETC.... $89 PC 3, 6RE, 7, 11 (A30) $69 PC 320 THRU 780 (E40) $89 NEC SERIES 2 LASER MODEL 90,95 $105 PLEASE NOTE: 1) WE DO NOT SEND OUT CATALOGS OR PRICE LISTS 2) WE DO NOT FAX QUOTES OR PRICE LISTS. 3) WE DO NOT SELL TO RESELLERS OR BUY FROM DISTRIBUTERS 4) WE DO NOT CARRY: BROTHER-MINOLTA-KYOSERA-PANASONIC PRODUCTS 5) WE DO NOT CARRY: XEROX-FUJITSU-OKIDATA OR SHARP PRODUCTS 6) WE DO NOT CARRY ANY COLOR PRINTER SUPPLIES 7) WE DO NOT CARRY DESKJET/INKJET OR BUBBLEJET SUPPLIES ****OUR ORDER LINE IS 770-399-0953 **** ****OUR CUSTOMER SERVICE LINE IS 800-586-0540**** ****OUR E-MAIL REMOVAL AND COMPLAINT LINE IS 800-650-5062**** ****PLACE YOUR ORDER AS FOLLOWS**** : BY PHONE 770-399-0953 BY FAX: 770-698-9700 BY MAIL: BENCHMARK PRINT SUPPLY 7540 BRIDGEGATE COURT , ATLANTA GA 30350 MAKE SURE YOU INCLUDE THE FOLLOWING INFORMATION IN YOUR ORDER: 1) PHONE NUMBER 2) COMPANY NAME 3) SHIPPING ADDRESS 4) YOUR NAME 5) ITEMS NEEDED WITH QUANTITIES 6) METHOD OF PAYMENT. (COD OR CREDIT CARD) 7) CREDIT CARD NUMBER WITH EXPIRATION DATE 1) WE SHIP UPS GROUND. ADD $4.5 FOR SHIPPING AND HANDLING. 2) WE ACCEPT ALL MAJOR CREDIT CARD OR "CHECK BY FAX" ORDERS. 3) OUR STANDARD MERCHANDISE REFUND POLICY IS NET 30 DAYS 4) OUR STANDARD MERCHANDISE REPLCAMENT POLICY IS NET 90 DAYS. NOTE: OWNERS OF ANY OF THE DOMAINS THAT APPEAR IN THE HEADER OF THIS MESSAGE, ARE IN NO WAY ASSOCIATED WITH, PROMOTING, DISTRIBUTING OR ENDORSING ANY OF THE PRODUCTS ADVERTISED HEREIN AND ARE NOT LIABLE TO ANY CLAIMS THAT MAY ARISE THEREOF. * * * * * * * * * * * * * * From the Listowner * * * * * * * * * * * * . To unsubscribe from this list, send a message to: majordomo at scn.org In the body of the message, type: unsubscribe scn ==== Messages posted on this list are also available on the web at: ==== * * * * * * * http://www.scn.org/volunteers/scn-l/ * * * * * * * From kurt at grogatch.seaslug.org Mon May 24 10:04:50 1999 From: kurt at grogatch.seaslug.org (Kurt Cockrum) Date: Mon, 24 May 1999 10:04:50 -0700 Subject: copier & laser printer supplies advertisement (really: anti-spam law - a paper tiger?) Message-ID: <199905241704.KAA24412@grogatch.seaslug.org> References: <199905240601.XAA15047 at scn.org>, <199905240601.XAA15048 at scn.org>, <199905240601.XAA15049 at scn.org> art333 at collegemail.com spammed, using the usual exploits to unmoderated majordomo lists: >[...] >BY MAIL: BENCHMARK PRINT SUPPLY > 7540 BRIDGEGATE COURT >, ATLANTA GA 30350 >[...] Gentlefolk, have your droids ignite their engines and load their terrain maps. May the force be with you... Unfortunately, there really isn't much of a defense against this sort of thing except *forcing* lists to be moderated, which is sort of counterproductive in terms of the sudden quantum jump in time/energy of the list-owner... I certainly don't want to become a list moderator myself; life's just too damn short for that kind of thing. >[...] >NOTE: OWNERS OF ANY OF THE DOMAINS THAT APPEAR IN THE HEADER OF >THIS MESSAGE, ARE IN NO WAY ASSOCIATED WITH, PROMOTING, >DISTRIBUTING OR ENDORSING ANY OF THE PRODUCTS ADVERTISED HEREIN >AND ARE NOT LIABLE TO ANY CLAIMS THAT MAY ARISE THEREOF. ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^ >[...] Hmmm...looks *almost* like a challenge. It ain't quite, tho, because a strict reading reveals all they are saying is that the spammer isn't responsible if your printer gets gummed up. Well, whoop-te-doo... Personally, I think the anti-spam law's bullshit, and I think spammers know it, too. It was crafted solely to give the impression to Stoopid People (the most precious resource politicians have in a democracy, after all) that the legislature was actually doing some real work, and so need *not* contain actual enforcable substance. Does anybody know if the cases brought under the law ever had an outcome that was actually detrimental (not just on paper) to the spammers? And I don't mean just getting a judgement, either, I mean actual *loss* of assets or liberty, the only things that really matter. Of course, the real nitty gritty is this: does SCN have access to a "Johnny Cochran"-type who can see this thru to the end, *winning* and *collecting* a whopping-big judgement to be split between him and us? because that's what it'll take. NLG pussycats need not apply. --kurt NATO's unfair! If they can bomb Serbian radio & TV stations, why can't they bomb ours? * * * * * * * * * * * * * * From the Listowner * * * * * * * * * * * * . To unsubscribe from this list, send a message to: majordomo at scn.org In the body of the message, type: unsubscribe scn ==== Messages posted on this list are also available on the web at: ==== * * * * * * * http://www.scn.org/volunteers/scn-l/ * * * * * * * From jj at scn.org Mon May 24 11:27:27 1999 From: jj at scn.org (J. Johnson) Date: Mon, 24 May 1999 11:27:27 -0700 (PDT) Subject: copier & laser printer supplies advertisement In-Reply-To: <199905240601.XAA15049@scn.org> Message-ID: The following was extracted from the spam with the above subject line that went to various SCN mailing lists on Monday, and is made available to our members so that complaints, if any, will be directed to the proper party. (If you do make a complaint, remind them that 1- advertising on the Internet should be done from a Web page only, and 2- they are responsible for the actions of agents or subcontractors they hire.) A complaint has also been made to the ISP through which the spam originated. === JJ ================================================================= On Mon, 24 May 1999 art333 at collegemail.com wrote: > BENCHMARK PRINT SUPPLY > [blah,blah,blah] > > ****OUR CUSTOMER SERVICE LINE IS 800-586-0540**** > ****OUR E-MAIL REMOVAL AND COMPLAINT LINE IS 800-650-5062**** > * * * * * * * * * * * * * * From the Listowner * * * * * * * * * * * * . To unsubscribe from this list, send a message to: majordomo at scn.org In the body of the message, type: unsubscribe scn ==== Messages posted on this list are also available on the web at: ==== * * * * * * * http://www.scn.org/volunteers/scn-l/ * * * * * * * From ljbeedle at scn.org Mon May 24 11:41:38 1999 From: ljbeedle at scn.org (Lois Beedle) Date: Mon, 24 May 1999 11:41:38 -0700 (PDT) Subject: copier & laser printer supplies advertisement (really: anti-spam law - a paper tiger?) In-Reply-To: <199905241704.KAA24412@grogatch.seaslug.org> Message-ID: I did have to change my list to moderated and it can be a pain I can tell already. But was getting lot's of complaints. Lois I Haven't Lost My Mind, It's Backed Up On Disk Somewhere * * * * * * * * * * * * * * From the Listowner * * * * * * * * * * * * . To unsubscribe from this list, send a message to: majordomo at scn.org In the body of the message, type: unsubscribe scn ==== Messages posted on this list are also available on the web at: ==== * * * * * * * http://www.scn.org/volunteers/scn-l/ * * * * * * * From levity at rpi.edu Mon May 24 14:47:35 1999 From: levity at rpi.edu (David Levinger) Date: Mon, 24 May 1999 14:47:35 -0700 (PDT) Subject: copier & laser printer supplies advertisement (really: anti-spam law - a paper tiger?) In-Reply-To: References: <199905241704.KAA24412@grogatch.seaslug.org> Message-ID: For spam protection on SCN lists, the easiest form of spam prevention is to only allow postings from list members, with approval required by the moderator for non-members' postings. ...David At 6:41 PM -0000 5/24/1999, Lois Beedle wrote: >I did have to change my list to moderated and it can be a pain I can tell >already. But was getting lot's of complaints. >Lois > >I Haven't Lost My Mind, It's Backed Up On Disk Somewhere > >* * * * * * * * * * * * * * From the Listowner * * * * * * * * * * * * >. To unsubscribe from this list, send a message to: >majordomo at scn.org In the body of the message, type: >unsubscribe local-computer-activists >END * * * * * * * * * * * * * * From the Listowner * * * * * * * * * * * * . To unsubscribe from this list, send a message to: majordomo at scn.org In the body of the message, type: unsubscribe scn ==== Messages posted on this list are also available on the web at: ==== * * * * * * * http://www.scn.org/volunteers/scn-l/ * * * * * * * From kurt Mon May 24 15:32:05 1999 From: kurt (Kurt Cockrum) Date: Mon, 24 May 1999 15:32:05 -0700 (PDT) Subject: art333 Message-ID: <199905242232.PAA20617@scn.org> In-Reply-To: References: <199905241704.KAA24412 at grogatch.seaslug.org>, Dave Levinger said: >For spam protection on SCN lists, the easiest form of spam prevention is to >only allow postings from list members, with approval required by the >moderator for non-members' postings. I think that's how the hardware list is configured and has been. I believe that it's the default anyway for all the lists. Non-member *postings* were never an issue, AFAIK. Judging from the mj log entry I posted earlier (most of you never saw that, since it was directed to hardware only; see below), where art333 got our mj help speil, they were apparently able to exploit vulnerabilities we don't know anything about. User activity *is* being logged: May 23 23:01:50 scn majordomo[15169] {art333 at collegemail.com} help If he joined any lists, we'd see it. Unless the guy's so good he's *selectively* editing the logfile, *leaving* his help-request, but *deleting* the list-joining traces. That seems kinda far-fetched to me... I did find a bunch of world-read perms in a bunch of mailing lists, which I fixec, but *some* of the spammed lists *didn't* have world-read perms. So that wasn't the exploit. --kurt * * * * * * * * * * * * * * From the Listowner * * * * * * * * * * * * . To unsubscribe from this list, send a message to: majordomo at scn.org In the body of the message, type: unsubscribe scn ==== Messages posted on this list are also available on the web at: ==== * * * * * * * http://www.scn.org/volunteers/scn-l/ * * * * * * * From chanh at scn.org Mon May 24 15:41:11 1999 From: chanh at scn.org (Chanh Ong) Date: Mon, 24 May 1999 15:41:11 -0700 (PDT) Subject: art333 In-Reply-To: <199905242232.PAA20617@scn.org> Message-ID: I wonder would the spam post these message via our web interface? ------------------------------------------------------------------ ^ Chanh Ong (SCN) ^^^ Home of Mount Rainier Seattle, Washington ----------------- http://www.scn.org/edu/index.html -------------- On Mon, 24 May 1999, Kurt Cockrum wrote: > In-Reply-To: > References: <199905241704.KAA24412 at grogatch.seaslug.org>, > > > Dave Levinger said: > >For spam protection on SCN lists, the easiest form of spam prevention is to > >only allow postings from list members, with approval required by the > >moderator for non-members' postings. > > I think that's how the hardware list is configured and has been. > I believe that it's the default anyway for all the lists. > Non-member *postings* were never an issue, AFAIK. Judging from > the mj log entry I posted earlier (most of you never saw that, since it > was directed to hardware only; see below), where art333 got our mj help speil, > they were apparently able to exploit vulnerabilities we don't know anything > about. User activity *is* being logged: > May 23 23:01:50 scn majordomo[15169] {art333 at collegemail.com} help > If he joined any lists, we'd see it. Unless the guy's so good he's > *selectively* editing the logfile, *leaving* his help-request, but *deleting* > the list-joining traces. That seems kinda far-fetched to me... > I did find a bunch of world-read perms in a bunch of mailing lists, which I > fixec, but *some* of the spammed lists *didn't* have world-read perms. > So that wasn't the exploit. > --kurt > * * * * * * * * * * * * * * From the Listowner * * * * * * * * * * * * > . To unsubscribe from this list, send a message to: > majordomo at scn.org In the body of the message, type: > unsubscribe scn > ==== Messages posted on this list are also available on the web at: ==== > * * * * * * * http://www.scn.org/volunteers/scn-l/ * * * * * * * > * * * * * * * * * * * * * * From the Listowner * * * * * * * * * * * * . To unsubscribe from this list, send a message to: majordomo at scn.org In the body of the message, type: unsubscribe scn ==== Messages posted on this list are also available on the web at: ==== * * * * * * * http://www.scn.org/volunteers/scn-l/ * * * * * * * From bb615 at scn.org Mon May 24 15:52:18 1999 From: bb615 at scn.org (Rod Clark) Date: Mon, 24 May 1999 15:52:18 -0700 (PDT) Subject: art333 In-Reply-To: <199905242232.PAA20617@scn.org> Message-ID: > Dave Levinger said: > >For spam protection on SCN lists, the easiest form of spam > >prevention is to only allow postings from list members, with > >approval required by the moderator for non-members' postings. Kurt Cockrun wrote: > I think that's how the hardware list is configured and has been. > I believe that it's the default anyway for all the lists. Kurt, My understanding is that SCN's policy is that the hardware list is set up to accept postings from anyone, even though membership in the list is restricted. This is in order to offer better response to system problems, and become aware sooner of troubles that users are having. This is (or should be) true of most or all SCN Association lists, but is not the case for lists for Information Providers, which are set up by default to reject messages from anyone who's not subscribed. Rod * * * * * * * * * * * * * * From the Listowner * * * * * * * * * * * * . To unsubscribe from this list, send a message to: majordomo at scn.org In the body of the message, type: unsubscribe scn ==== Messages posted on this list are also available on the web at: ==== * * * * * * * http://www.scn.org/volunteers/scn-l/ * * * * * * * From kv9x at scn.org Mon May 24 16:59:49 1999 From: kv9x at scn.org (Brian High) Date: Mon, 24 May 1999 16:59:49 -0700 Subject: Closing the gap between tech haves, have-nots Message-ID: <3749E7F5.2A84F984@scn.org> X-No-Archive: Yes Silicon Valley Breaking News Posted at 3:46 p.m. PDT Saturday, May 22, 1999 Closing the gap between tech haves, have-nots BY JAMES J. MITCHELL Mercury News Staff Writer DURING the last three years, the Digital Clubhouse Network, based in Sunnyvale, has developed a series of innovative programs aimed at narrowing the gap between high-tech haves and have-nots. Several thousand people, including seniors, the disabled and youngsters from low-income families, have entered the digital age, thanks to Digital Clubhouses in Sunnyvale and New York City. The organization has done so well that it's a finalist for a Computerworld Smithsonian award, generally considered the Academy Awards of the information technology industry. Now the DCN is preparing to expand its program dramatically in Silicon Valley, in Northern California and around the country. If the DCN, its corporate partners and many volunteers succeed, they'll show the world that the benefits of technology need not be restricted to a relatively small elite. The Digital Clubhouse in Sunnyvale has already proved that, albeit on a small scale. One of its successes, called Kids on the Web, allows elementary schoolchildren who don't normally have access to computers to learn to use the Internet. Another is a program that helped World War II veterans and women with breast cancer create touching digital stories about their experiences. A third is a program that teaches disabled and at-risk teens how to create Web pages, and exposes them to leadership and interpersonal skills needed for success in school and on the job. Perhaps most impressive, the DCN has developed systems that allow the technology-rich to share their bounty -- of knowledge and products -- with the technology-poor. Most instructors are volunteers -- and many are youngsters who learned computer skills at a clubhouse. Most of the equipment and software at the clubhouses was donated by companies like Mitsubishi Electronics Inc., Cisco Systems Inc. and Adobe Systems Inc. NOW the DCN is pushing the envelope a bit further. This summer it will bring residents of two Santa Clara County low-income housing projects to the Sunnyvale Clubhouse to learn about technology and how to set up small clubhouses in their housing developments. The clubhouses should be outfitted by fall, says Warren Hegg, co-founder and CEO of the DCN. If these two clubhouses work out well, Hegg would like to replicate the process. His most ambitious goal is to open clubhouses in other states. But that would require a dramatic increase in funding. Up to now, the DCN and its clubhouses have been operated largely by volunteers. Companies have been generous with their products, and one executive donated $500,000 in stock for an endowment. But cash has been scarce. Hegg estimates that to undertake his national campaign he'll need at least 10 partners willing to contribute $100,000 each a year for three years. The DCN's efforts to help the technologically disadvantaged and its way to do so have touched a nerve in the business community. For the Mitsubishi Electric America Foundation, an early and consistent backer whose mission is to help people with disabilities through technology, it was "love at first sight," says Rayna Aylward, the foundation's executive director. Cisco, which has several employees who work at or advise the Sunnyvale clubhouse, is pleased at the impact the clubhouse is having on people's lives. "It's a wonderful program," says Maideh Radpour, the company's senior manager of community investment. With that kind of support, the DCN may well have a chance to fulfill its dreams. To contact the Sunnyvale Digital Clubhouse, visit its Web site (Digiclub), send e-mail to Admin at digiclub.org or call (408) 481-0880. _________________________________________________________________ Contact James J. Mitchell at jmitchell at sjmercury.com or (408) 920-5544. The fax number is (408) 920-5917. )1999 Mercury Center. The information you receive online from Mercury Center is protected by the copyright laws of the United States. The copyright laws prohibit any copying, redistributing, retransmitting, or repurposing of any copyright-protected material. * * * * * * * * * * * * * * From the Listowner * * * * * * * * * * * * . To unsubscribe from this list, send a message to: majordomo at scn.org In the body of the message, type: unsubscribe scn ==== Messages posted on this list are also available on the web at: ==== * * * * * * * http://www.scn.org/volunteers/scn-l/ * * * * * * * From ljbeedle at scn.org Mon May 24 18:45:29 1999 From: ljbeedle at scn.org (Lois Beedle) Date: Mon, 24 May 1999 18:45:29 -0700 (PDT) Subject: copier & laser printer supplies advertisement (really: anti-spam law - a paper tiger?) In-Reply-To: Message-ID: I didn't want to have to approve each person that signed up. So I went with the moderate messages. We tend to have only announcment type messages and I didn't want to discourage anyone from signing up. Besides my members are scattered across the country and I probably wouldn't recognize their email anyhow. It was set up so that only a member could post to the list when the list was created. And we were getting spammed hard. Lois I Haven't Lost My Mind, It's Backed Up On Disk Somewhere On Mon, 24 May 1999, David Levinger wrote: > For spam protection on SCN lists, the easiest form of spam prevention is to > only allow postings from list members, with approval required by the > moderator for non-members' postings. > > ...David > > At 6:41 PM -0000 5/24/1999, Lois Beedle wrote: > >I did have to change my list to moderated and it can be a pain I can tell > >already. But was getting lot's of complaints. > >Lois > > > >I Haven't Lost My Mind, It's Backed Up On Disk Somewhere > > > >* * * * * * * * * * * * * * From the Listowner * * * * * * * * * * * * > >. To unsubscribe from this list, send a message to: > >majordomo at scn.org In the body of the message, type: > >unsubscribe local-computer-activists > >END > > > > * * * * * * * * * * * * * * From the Listowner * * * * * * * * * * * * > . To unsubscribe from this list, send a message to: > majordomo at scn.org In the body of the message, type: > unsubscribe scn > ==== Messages posted on this list are also available on the web at: ==== > * * * * * * * http://www.scn.org/volunteers/scn-l/ * * * * * * * > * * * * * * * * * * * * * * From the Listowner * * * * * * * * * * * * . To unsubscribe from this list, send a message to: majordomo at scn.org In the body of the message, type: unsubscribe scn ==== Messages posted on this list are also available on the web at: ==== * * * * * * * http://www.scn.org/volunteers/scn-l/ * * * * * * * From spt at scn.org Tue May 25 09:24:28 1999 From: spt at scn.org (Seattle Public Theater) Date: Tue, 25 May 1999 09:24:28 -0700 (PDT) Subject: Kindly notify Message-ID: Dear whomever: hardware/software, webmasters, ??? I change one page on my site once a month. Today, I went in did my usual cd /web.root/arts/spt/ and it didn't respond. I managed, in the usual try-anything manner, to find out that now this file is /web/arts/spt I reallly DON'T appreciate having NO notification of this. ALL IPS SHOULD HAVE BEEN NOTIFIED IF YOU ARE CHANGING DIRECTORY NAMES. Barb * * * * * * * * * * * * * * From the Listowner * * * * * * * * * * * * . To unsubscribe from this list, send a message to: majordomo at scn.org In the body of the message, type: unsubscribe scn ==== Messages posted on this list are also available on the web at: ==== * * * * * * * http://www.scn.org/volunteers/scn-l/ * * * * * * * From bb615 at scn.org Tue May 25 10:22:57 1999 From: bb615 at scn.org (Rod Clark) Date: Tue, 25 May 1999 10:22:57 -0700 (PDT) Subject: Kindly notify In-Reply-To: Message-ID: > cd /web.root/arts/spt/ > and it didn't respond. > > I managed, in the usual try-anything manner, to find out that now this > file is > /web/arts/spt > > I reallly DON'T appreciate having NO notification of this. ALL IPS SHOULD > HAVE BEEN NOTIFIED IF YOU ARE CHANGING DIRECTORY NAMES. Barb, Please try doing "cd /web.root/arts/spt" again. It should work the same way as always. If not, let us know. The two directory names /web and /web.root have been interchangeable for a long time. They're two names for the same file directory. I don't remember when we started allowing the simpler form, but it was probably a couple of years ago. Either one works as well as the other, everywhere in the system. You don't need to change anything, and can continue using /web.root as always. The /web name is the one that's printed on the screen when you do a "pwd" to print the name of the current directory. We've been reducing the number of places that the old "/web.root" syntax is used, for some time now. The "pwd" command has been displaying /web as the preferred name for the directory since early this year. The help file about this is on the Help menu in the Information Providers section, as "How to Set Up Your Information Provider Web Site". Please see http://www.scn.org/help/publish/ipweb.html Maybe we should periodically send that file to everybody in e-mail, when paragraphs in it that describe various features are updated, but people also tend to complain about receiving un-asked-for e-mail. Would you mind receiving a monthly Information Provider bulletin in e-mail? If enough people don't object, maybe that would be a good idea. Rod Clark * * * * * * * * * * * * * * From the Listowner * * * * * * * * * * * * . To unsubscribe from this list, send a message to: majordomo at scn.org In the body of the message, type: unsubscribe scn ==== Messages posted on this list are also available on the web at: ==== * * * * * * * http://www.scn.org/volunteers/scn-l/ * * * * * * * From bk269 at scn.org Tue May 25 18:29:41 1999 From: bk269 at scn.org (Stanley N. Protigal) Date: Tue, 25 May 1999 18:29:41 -0700 (PDT) Subject: Majordomo results: test help message (fwd) Message-ID: ---------- Forwarded message ---------- Date: Tue, 25 May 1999 18:26:50 -0700 (PDT) From: majordomo at scn.org To: bk269 at scn.org Subject: Majordomo results: test help message -- >>>> help governance Welcome to the Seattle Community Network Information Server! This is the general description of things you can do with the server by mailing it messages. The specific SCN functions are outlined below, followed by the more general description of the functions available in the software that we are using (called majordomo). If you want to get some specific information, we have an archive of files that you can have sent to you by e-mail, by just sending a message to our information server. The address that you would send a message to is: info at scn.org (you probably already know this, since you got this message). To get one of the following files: faq - Our Frequently Asked Questions list netiquette - A description of the 'network etiquette' expected of all users of SCN policy - The current SCN policy document register - The current SCN registration form send a message to info at scn.org, with one of the following as the TEXT of the message (the subject: line is ignored): get scninfo faq get scninfo netiquette get scninfo policy get scninfo register We will be expanding the list of files available. You can get a list of what is available by sending a message to info at scn.org with the following as the TEXT of the message: index scninfo That's it for the general SCN info - below is the more general help information for this service. Thanks for checking in with us!! This is the general help information for Brent Chapman's "Majordomo" mailing list manager, version 1.93. In the description below items contained in []'s are optional. When providing the item, do not include the []'s around it. It understands the following commands: subscribe [
] Subscribe yourself (or
if specified) to the named . unsubscribe [
] Unsubscribe yourself (or
if specified) from the named . get Get a file related to . index Return an index of files you can "get" for . which [
] Find out which lists you (or
if specified) are on. who Find out who is on the named . info Retrieve the general introductory information for the named . lists Show the lists served by this Majordomo server. help Retrieve this message. end Stop processing commands (useful if your mailer adds a signature). Commands should be sent in the body of an email message to: info at scn.org Commands in the "Subject:" line NOT processed. If you have any questions or problems, please contact "owner-majordomo". >>>> help does_not_exist Welcome to the Seattle Community Network Information Server! This is the general description of things you can do with the server by mailing it messages. The specific SCN functions are outlined below, followed by the more general description of the functions available in the software that we are using (called majordomo). If you want to get some specific information, we have an archive of files that you can have sent to you by e-mail, by just sending a message to our information server. The address that you would send a message to is: info at scn.org (you probably already know this, since you got this message). To get one of the following files: faq - Our Frequently Asked Questions list netiquette - A description of the 'network etiquette' expected of all users of SCN policy - The current SCN policy document register - The current SCN registration form send a message to info at scn.org, with one of the following as the TEXT of the message (the subject: line is ignored): get scninfo faq get scninfo netiquette get scninfo policy get scninfo register We will be expanding the list of files available. You can get a list of what is available by sending a message to info at scn.org with the following as the TEXT of the message: index scninfo That's it for the general SCN info - below is the more general help information for this service. Thanks for checking in with us!! This is the general help information for Brent Chapman's "Majordomo" mailing list manager, version 1.93. In the description below items contained in []'s are optional. When providing the item, do not include the []'s around it. It understands the following commands: subscribe [
] Subscribe yourself (or
if specified) to the named . unsubscribe [
] Unsubscribe yourself (or
if specified) from the named . get Get a file related to . index Return an index of files you can "get" for . which [
] Find out which lists you (or
if specified) are on. who Find out who is on the named . info Retrieve the general introductory information for the named . lists Show the lists served by this Majordomo server. help Retrieve this message. end Stop processing commands (useful if your mailer adds a signature). Commands should be sent in the body of an email message to: info at scn.org Commands in the "Subject:" line NOT processed. If you have any questions or problems, please contact "owner-majordomo". >>>> help mentors Welcome to the Seattle Community Network Information Server! This is the general description of things you can do with the server by mailing it messages. The specific SCN functions are outlined below, followed by the more general description of the functions available in the software that we are using (called majordomo). If you want to get some specific information, we have an archive of files that you can have sent to you by e-mail, by just sending a message to our information server. The address that you would send a message to is: info at scn.org (you probably already know this, since you got this message). To get one of the following files: faq - Our Frequently Asked Questions list netiquette - A description of the 'network etiquette' expected of all users of SCN policy - The current SCN policy document register - The current SCN registration form send a message to info at scn.org, with one of the following as the TEXT of the message (the subject: line is ignored): get scninfo faq get scninfo netiquette get scninfo policy get scninfo register We will be expanding the list of files available. You can get a list of what is available by sending a message to info at scn.org with the following as the TEXT of the message: index scninfo That's it for the general SCN info - below is the more general help information for this service. Thanks for checking in with us!! This is the general help information for Brent Chapman's "Majordomo" mailing list manager, version 1.93. In the description below items contained in []'s are optional. When providing the item, do not include the []'s around it. It understands the following commands: subscribe [
] Subscribe yourself (or
if specified) to the named . unsubscribe [
] Unsubscribe yourself (or
if specified) from the named . get Get a file related to . index Return an index of files you can "get" for . which [
] Find out which lists you (or
if specified) are on. who Find out who is on the named . info Retrieve the general introductory information for the named . lists Show the lists served by this Majordomo server. help Retrieve this message. end Stop processing commands (useful if your mailer adds a signature). Commands should be sent in the body of an email message to: info at scn.org Commands in the "Subject:" line NOT processed. If you have any questions or problems, please contact "owner-majordomo". >>>> help services Welcome to the Seattle Community Network Information Server! This is the general description of things you can do with the server by mailing it messages. The specific SCN functions are outlined below, followed by the more general description of the functions available in the software that we are using (called majordomo). If you want to get some specific information, we have an archive of files that you can have sent to you by e-mail, by just sending a message to our information server. The address that you would send a message to is: info at scn.org (you probably already know this, since you got this message). To get one of the following files: faq - Our Frequently Asked Questions list netiquette - A description of the 'network etiquette' expected of all users of SCN policy - The current SCN policy document register - The current SCN registration form send a message to info at scn.org, with one of the following as the TEXT of the message (the subject: line is ignored): get scninfo faq get scninfo netiquette get scninfo policy get scninfo register We will be expanding the list of files available. You can get a list of what is available by sending a message to info at scn.org with the following as the TEXT of the message: index scninfo That's it for the general SCN info - below is the more general help information for this service. Thanks for checking in with us!! This is the general help information for Brent Chapman's "Majordomo" mailing list manager, version 1.93. In the description below items contained in []'s are optional. When providing the item, do not include the []'s around it. It understands the following commands: subscribe [
] Subscribe yourself (or
if specified) to the named . unsubscribe [
] Unsubscribe yourself (or
if specified) from the named . get Get a file related to . index Return an index of files you can "get" for . which [
] Find out which lists you (or
if specified) are on. who Find out who is on the named . info Retrieve the general introductory information for the named . lists Show the lists served by this Majordomo server. help Retrieve this message. end Stop processing commands (useful if your mailer adds a signature). Commands should be sent in the body of an email message to: info at scn.org Commands in the "Subject:" line NOT processed. If you have any questions or problems, please contact "owner-majordomo". >>>> end END OF COMMANDS * * * * * * * * * * * * * * From the Listowner * * * * * * * * * * * * . To unsubscribe from this list, send a message to: majordomo at scn.org In the body of the message, type: unsubscribe scn ==== Messages posted on this list are also available on the web at: ==== * * * * * * * http://www.scn.org/volunteers/scn-l/ * * * * * * * From kurt at grogatch.seaslug.org Wed May 26 10:01:13 1999 From: kurt at grogatch.seaslug.org (Kurt Cockrum) Date: Wed, 26 May 1999 10:01:13 -0700 Subject: Life imitates art333 Message-ID: <199905261701.KAA09066@grogatch.seaslug.org> References: <199905240601.XAA15049 at scn.org>, <199905240601.XAA15048 at scn.org>, <199905240601.XAA15047 at scn.org>, <199905241704.KAA24412 at grogatch.seaslug.org>, <199905242154.OAA08979 at scn.org>, <199905242245.PAA26090 at scn.org>, , <199905242232.PAA20617 at scn.org>, <3749A00C.C1394C28 at uswest.net>, <199905242145.OAA05254 at scn.org>, <004a01bea639$61ead840$a78cc5ce at thurman.com>, , , <000a01bea6ce$bfe9d8c0$a78cc5ce at thurman.com>, <199905251944.MAA00528 at scn.org>, , <199905260455.VAA04175 at grogatch.seaslug.org> After all this backNforth, I think it's time SCN {governance,BOD,everybody} decided whether or not to test the Paper Tiger AntiSpam Law. If they decide NOT to, for what MIGHT be very good reasons, then I think everybody ought to just SHUT UP about spam and learn to LIVE with it. If people can tolerate some of the major ongoing problems in society and continue to pay the taxes that support it without batting an eye (such as the drug war, kids blowing each other away, rogue cops, runaway prison construction, Patty Murray/Slade Gorton, software patents, NAFTA/MAI/WTO, road rage, global warming, ethnic cleansing, weapons exports, corporations-as-persons, you-name-it), they sure-as-hell can learn to live with SPAM, because it's really pretty trivial compared to ANY of these. As Pogo said, "We have met the enemy and he is us". So, unless people are willing to seriously and relentlessly pursue art333 with all the evidence we have, and do the homework and spend the money, and show up in court (BTW my esteemed spouse suggested Small Claims Court), win the case, get the judgement, collect on it, yadda, yadda, then EVERYBODY SHUT UP ABOUT SPAM ALREADY!!!!!! --kurt * * * * * * * * * * * * * * From the Listowner * * * * * * * * * * * * . To unsubscribe from this list, send a message to: majordomo at scn.org In the body of the message, type: unsubscribe scn ==== Messages posted on this list are also available on the web at: ==== * * * * * * * http://www.scn.org/volunteers/scn-l/ * * * * * * * From jmabel at saltmine.com Wed May 26 10:28:47 1999 From: jmabel at saltmine.com (Joe Mabel) Date: Wed, 26 May 1999 10:28:47 -0700 Subject: Life imitates art333 Message-ID: <01BEA762.8A7A0A40.jmabel@saltmine.com> I for one (a) don't like spam and (b) don't believe in unnecessarily using the gov't as my enforcer. I will continue, when I receive spam, to email to postmaster and abuse along the trail of where it came from. Usually, the result of this is that I get back an email letting me know the spammer's account has been taken away, which strikes me as appropriate. I assume that if there is an ISP who is a routine source of spam, the other ISPs will similarly stop accepting email from that ISP. To me, this seems like a better solution than bothering with the courts & the law. It also seems better than "learning to live with" an abusive behavior. JM -----Original Message----- From: Kurt Cockrum [SMTP:kurt at grogatch.seaslug.org] Sent: Wednesday, May 26, 1999 10:01 AM To: governance at scn.org; hardware at scn.org Cc: local-computer-activists at scn.org; scn at scn.org Subject: Life imitates art333 References: <199905240601.XAA15049 at scn.org>, <199905240601.XAA15048 at scn.org>, <199905240601.XAA15047 at scn.org>, <199905241704.KAA24412 at grogatch.seaslug.org>, <199905242154.OAA08979 at scn.org>, <199905242245.PAA26090 at scn.org>, , <199905242232.PAA20617 at scn.org>, <3749A00C.C1394C28 at uswest.net>, <199905242145.OAA05254 at scn.org>, <004a01bea639$61ead840$a78cc5ce at thurman.com>, , , <000a01bea6ce$bfe9d8c0$a78cc5ce at thurman.com>, <199905251944.MAA00528 at scn.org>, , <199905260455.VAA04175 at grogatch.seaslug.org> After all this backNforth, I think it's time SCN {governance,BOD,everybody} decided whether or not to test the Paper Tiger AntiSpam Law. If they decide NOT to, for what MIGHT be very good reasons, then I think everybody ought to just SHUT UP about spam and learn to LIVE with it. If people can tolerate some of the major ongoing problems in society and continue to pay the taxes that support it without batting an eye (such as the drug war, kids blowing each other away, rogue cops, runaway prison construction, Patty Murray/Slade Gorton, software patents, NAFTA/MAI/WTO, road rage, global warming, ethnic cleansing, weapons exports, corporations-as-persons, you-name-it), they sure-as-hell can learn to live with SPAM, because it's really pretty trivial compared to ANY of these. As Pogo said, "We have met the enemy and he is us". So, unless people are willing to seriously and relentlessly pursue art333 with all the evidence we have, and do the homework and spend the money, and show up in court (BTW my esteemed spouse suggested Small Claims Court), win the case, get the judgement, collect on it, yadda, yadda, then EVERYBODY SHUT UP ABOUT SPAM ALREADY!!!!!! --kurt * * * * * * * * * * * * * * From the Listowner * * * * * * * * * * * * . To unsubscribe from this list, send a message to: majordomo at scn.org In the body of the message, type: unsubscribe scn ==== Messages posted on this list are also available on the web at: ==== * * * * * * * http://www.scn.org/volunteers/scn-l/ * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * From the Listowner * * * * * * * * * * * * . To unsubscribe from this list, send a message to: majordomo at scn.org In the body of the message, type: unsubscribe scn ==== Messages posted on this list are also available on the web at: ==== * * * * * * * http://www.scn.org/volunteers/scn-l/ * * * * * * * From karyn at accessone.com Wed May 26 11:18:38 1999 From: karyn at accessone.com (Karyn Quinlan) Date: Wed, 26 May 1999 11:18:38 -0700 Subject: copier & laser printer supplies advertisement Message-ID: <3.0.1.32.19990526111838.00999e70@mail.accessone.com> I routinely report spam to abuse (see below). It takes 2 seconds. However, the problem of spam is much larger. The marketing used by such companies (free email, trial offers etc.) is a huge part of the problem. Spammers can move on very quickly to yet another free and/or trial account. Personally, I do not think spam is a trivial problem. It has real costs. I suggest that at a minimum people report all spam to abuse at _____.com or postmaster at ____.com If the marketing efforts of these companies start to clog up *their* system, things may change. Just a thought... >From: "Friendly Email" >To: "Karyn Quinlan" >Subject: RE: copier & laser printer supplies advertisement >Date: Mon, 24 May 1999 23:44:20 -0400 >X-MSMail-Priority: Normal >X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V4.72.3110.3 >Importance: Normal >Content-Length: 5691 > >Hi! >  >Thank you for drawing the abuse to our attention. The matter has been >addressed and the appropriate action has been taken. It is our policy >not to allow SPAM and when we are alerted of the abuse of one of our >accounts, we move swiftly to ensure that the offending account is dealt >with accoringly. We've deleted this account for its offenses against our >Terms of Service. Again, thank you for notifying us. :) >  >================================== >Free e-mail located at http://friendlyemail.com >Cool domains with easy web and pop access. >voice-mail & fax : (619) 839-3873 > >~>-----Original Message----- >~>From: Karyn Quinlan [mailto:karyn at accessone.com] >~>Sent: Monday, May 24, 1999 12:48 PM >~>To: abuse at collegemail.com >~>Subject: copier & laser printer supplies advertisement >~> >~> >~> >~>>From: art333 at collegemail.com >~>>Subject: copier & laser printer supplies advertisement >~>>Date: Mon, 24 May 1999 01:35:57 >~>>To: undisclosed-recipients:; >~>>Sender: owner-local-computer-activists at scn.org >~>>Content-Length: 4308 >~>> >~>>BENCHMARK PRINT SUPPLY >~>> >~>>***LASER PRINTER TONER CARTRIDGES*** >~>>***FAX AND COPIER TONER*** >~>> >~>> CHECK OUT OUR NEW CARTRIDGE PRICES : >~>> >~>> >~>>APPLE >~>> >~>> LASER WRITER PRO 600 OR 16/600 $69 >~>> LASER WRITER SELECT 300,310.360 $64 >~>> LASER WRITER 300, 320, 360 $54 >~>> LASER WRITER LS,NT,2NTX,2F,2G & 2SC $54 >~>> LASER WRITER 12/640 $79 >~>> >~>>HEWLETT PACKARD >~>> >~>> LASERJET SERIES 2,3 & 3D $49 >~>> LASERJET SERIES 2P AND 3P $54 >~>> LASERJET SERIES 3SI AND 4SI $75 >~>> LASERJET SERIES 4L AND 4P $49 >~>> LASERJET SERIES 4, 4M, 5, 5M, 4+ $59 >~>> LASERJET SERIES 4000 HIGH YIELD $99 >~>> LASERJET SERIES 4V $95 >~>> LASERJET SERIES 5SI , 8000 $95 >~>> LASERJET SERIES 5L AND 6L $49 >~>> LASERJET SERIES 5P, 5MP, 6P, 6MP $59 >~>> LASERJET SERIES 5000 $89 >~>> LASERJET SERIES 1100 $49 >~>> LASERJET SERIES 2100 $89 >~>> >~>> >~>>HP LASERFAX >~>> >~>> LASERFAX 500, 700, FX1, $59 >~>> LASERFAX 5000, 7000, FX2, $59 >~>> LASERFAX FX3 $69 >~>> LASERFAX FX4 $79 >~>> >~>> >~>>LEXMARK >~>> >~>> OPTRA 4019, 4029 HIGH YIELD $135 >~>> OPTRA R, 4039, 4049 HIGH YIELD $135 >~>> OPTRA S 4059 HIGH YIELD $135 >~>> OPTRA E $59 >~>> OPTRA N $115 >~>> >~>> >~>>EPSON >~>> >~>> EPL-70000, 8000 $105 >~>> EPL-1000, 1500 $105 >~>> >~>> >~>>CANON >~>> >~>> LBP-430 $49 >~>> LBP-460, 465 $59 >~>> LBP-8 II $54 >~>> LBP-LX $54 >~>> LBP-MX $95 >~>> LBP-AX $49 >~>> LBP-EX $59 >~>> LBP-SX $49 >~>> LBP-BX $95 >~>> LBP-PX $49 >~>> LBP-WX $95 >~>> LBP-VX $59 >~>> CANON FAX L700 THRU L790 FX1 $59 >~>> CANONFAX L5000 L70000 FX2 $59 >~>> >~>> >~>>CANON COPIERS >~>> >~>> PC 20, 25 ETC.... $89 >~>> PC 3, 6RE, 7, 11 (A30) $69 >~>> PC 320 THRU 780 (E40) $89 >~>> >~>> >~>>NEC >~>> >~>> SERIES 2 LASER MODEL 90,95 $105 >~>> >~>> >~>>PLEASE NOTE: >~>> >~>>1) WE DO NOT SEND OUT CATALOGS OR PRICE LISTS >~>>2) WE DO NOT FAX QUOTES OR PRICE LISTS. >~>>3) WE DO NOT SELL TO RESELLERS OR BUY FROM DISTRIBUTERS >~>>4) WE DO NOT CARRY: BROTHER-MINOLTA-KYOSERA-PANASONIC PRODUCTS >~>>5) WE DO NOT CARRY: XEROX-FUJITSU-OKIDATA OR SHARP PRODUCTS >~>>6) WE DO NOT CARRY ANY COLOR PRINTER SUPPLIES >~>>7) WE DO NOT CARRY DESKJET/INKJET OR BUBBLEJET SUPPLIES >~>> >~>> >~>>****OUR ORDER LINE IS 770-399-0953 **** >~>>****OUR CUSTOMER SERVICE LINE IS 800-586-0540**** >~>>****OUR E-MAIL REMOVAL AND COMPLAINT LINE IS 800-650-5062**** >~>> >~>>****PLACE YOUR ORDER AS FOLLOWS**** : >~>> >~>>BY PHONE 770-399-0953 >~>> >~>>BY FAX: 770-698-9700 >~>> >~>>BY MAIL: BENCHMARK PRINT SUPPLY >~>> 7540 BRIDGEGATE COURT >~>>, ATLANTA GA 30350 >~>> >~>>MAKE SURE YOU INCLUDE THE FOLLOWING INFORMATION IN YOUR ORDER: >~>> >~>> 1) PHONE NUMBER >~>> 2) COMPANY NAME >~>> 3) SHIPPING ADDRESS >~>> 4) YOUR NAME >~>> 5) ITEMS NEEDED WITH QUANTITIES >~>> 6) METHOD OF PAYMENT. (COD OR CREDIT CARD) >~>> 7) CREDIT CARD NUMBER WITH EXPIRATION DATE >~>> >~>> >~>>1) WE SHIP UPS GROUND. ADD $4.5 FOR SHIPPING AND HANDLING. >~>>2) WE ACCEPT ALL MAJOR CREDIT CARD OR "CHECK BY FAX" ORDERS. >~>>3) OUR STANDARD MERCHANDISE REFUND POLICY IS NET 30 DAYS >~>>4) OUR STANDARD MERCHANDISE REPLCAMENT POLICY IS NET 90 DAYS. >~>> >~>> >~>> >~>> >~>>NOTE: OWNERS OF ANY OF THE DOMAINS THAT APPEAR IN THE HEADER OF >~>>THIS MESSAGE, ARE IN NO WAY ASSOCIATED WITH, PROMOTING, >~>>DISTRIBUTING OR ENDORSING ANY OF THE PRODUCTS ADVERTISED HEREIN >~>>AND ARE NOT LIABLE TO ANY CLAIMS THAT MAY ARISE THEREOF. >~>> >~>> >~>> >~>> >~>> >~>> >~>> >~>> >~>> >~>> >~>> >~>> >~>> >~>> >~>> >~>> >~>> >~>> >~>> >~>>* * * * * * * * * * * * * * From the Listowner * * * * * * * * * * * * >~>>. To unsubscribe from this list, send a message to: >~>>majordomo at scn.org In the body of the message, type: >~>>unsubscribe local-computer-activists >~>>END >~>> >~> > > * * * * * * * * * * * * * * From the Listowner * * * * * * * * * * * * . To unsubscribe from this list, send a message to: majordomo at scn.org In the body of the message, type: unsubscribe scn ==== Messages posted on this list are also available on the web at: ==== * * * * * * * http://www.scn.org/volunteers/scn-l/ * * * * * * * From scoth at scn.org Wed May 26 12:25:07 1999 From: scoth at scn.org (Scot Harkins on SCN.org) Date: Wed, 26 May 1999 12:25:07 -0700 Subject: Life imitates art333 References: <199905261811.LAA10991@scn.org> Message-ID: <004501bea7ad$7890d110$a78cc5ce@thurman.com> Oh, yes, anything worth doing is worth doing large. This would be a sizeable civil case. I said earlier taking a lawyer on "commission", but I'm really looking for the right word (duh!), which is, I think, "contingent", as in "contingent upon receiving payment from any money recovered as a result of the lawsuit." Thanks to Karyn's posting we have the details of who to sue: Benchmark Print Supply, 7540 Bridgegate Court, Atlanta, Georgia, 30350-4603, 770-399-0953. Note that the listing in USWestDex.com shows them as "Benchmark Print Supply and Laser" on 1091 Redstone Lane, Dunwoody, Georgia, 30338-2637, 770-399-5038. Here's the things this tells us: this is an established business by virtue of the fact that they've been around long enough to have a listing in an on-line directory. Their address, while different, is apparently in the same area. I determined that by the prefix (770-399). I called the order number and asked the person who answered if this was the store on Redstone Street (the address I got from USWestDex) and she said yes. I asked her the hours and she said they're open 10am to 6pm today. Okay, so we know they're real and established. What else do we know? How many separate instances came in and how many lists did they hit per instance? How many final deliveree's? I don't have the root password right now so I can't hunt the files myself for the message ID's. I presume we have archival copies from each list by which to compare how many lists were targeted by how many instances. What might really be going on here? Most likely this business did one of two things. They hired someone to advertise their products on the internet, and that party is the one that used spamming techniques. Alternately, someone at the business obtained spamming software and set about delivering advertisements. A third possibility is that this was done by a former employee with malicious intent, although that's less likely since the ad could generate actual sales, thus defeating his/her purpose, though the spam backlash would certainly hurt. No, but wait! A search on www.dogpile.com reveals that Benchmark Print Supply is a famous spammer. Washington State has a lawsuit filed against Benchmark (and the owner, Sam Khuri) in King County Superior Court. This is for using misleading subject lines and falsified header lines. It is being processed under RCW 19.86, the Unfair Business Practices-Consumer Protection Act and RCW 19.190, the Unsolicited Electronic Mail Act. There are many other sites naming Benchmark as a notorious spammer. Mister Khuri seems to continue his operation in spite of a pending lawsuit. He does have a domain name registered; laserdepot.com, which does map to an IP address, but the machine appears, sadly, to be down. There is also a domain "benchmarkprintsupply.com" registered under the company name "Benchmark Print Supply Must Die". It doesn't work, either, though I'm sure it would be entertaining to say the least. Well, at this point, we're still down to how many messages. We may also wish to contact the Attorney General's office regarding our situation and how it might relate to their lawsuit. If we have enough to go on we may wish to pursue a judgement. Enforcement of a judgement, however, may be a challenge that defeats any lawsuit we may win. We may end up with paper that says he owes us, but can we collect? That's another question for the AGO. So there we go. Now we know. What say you? Scot Scot Harkins (KA5KDU) | Systems Administrator, Thurman Ind, Bothell, WA North Bend, WA | Native Texan firmly planted in Western Washington scoth at bigfoot.com | SCA: Ld. Scot MacFin, Barony of Madrone, An Tir scoth at scn.org/msn.com | URL * * * * * * * * * * * * * * From the Listowner * * * * * * * * * * * * . To unsubscribe from this list, send a message to: majordomo at scn.org In the body of the message, type: unsubscribe scn ==== Messages posted on this list are also available on the web at: ==== * * * * * * * http://www.scn.org/volunteers/scn-l/ * * * * * * * From scoth at msn.com Wed May 26 12:41:16 1999 From: scoth at msn.com (Scot Harkins on MSN.com) Date: Wed, 26 May 1999 12:41:16 -0700 Subject: Life imitates art333 References: <199905261811.LAA10991@scn.org> <004501bea7ad$7890d110$a78cc5ce@thurman.com> Message-ID: <005c01bea7af$b91d67a0$a78cc5ce@thurman.com> Oh, and finally, _were we harmed_? Really the root question to all of this, you know. Did we experience downtime or other system problems as a result? Were we harmed enough to waste any more energy on this? Scot Scot Harkins (KA5KDU) | Systems Administrator, Thurman Ind, Bothell, WA North Bend, WA | Native Texan firmly planted in Western Washington scoth at bigfoot.com | SCA: Ld. Scot MacFin, Barony of Madrone, An Tir scoth at scn.org/msn.com | URL * * * * * * * * * * * * * * From the Listowner * * * * * * * * * * * * . To unsubscribe from this list, send a message to: majordomo at scn.org In the body of the message, type: unsubscribe scn ==== Messages posted on this list are also available on the web at: ==== * * * * * * * http://www.scn.org/volunteers/scn-l/ * * * * * * * From scoth at scn.org Wed May 26 13:01:30 1999 From: scoth at scn.org (Scot Harkins on SCN.org) Date: Wed, 26 May 1999 13:01:30 -0700 Subject: Life imitates art333 References: <199905261811.LAA10991@scn.org> <004501bea7ad$7890d110$a78cc5ce@thurman.com> <005c01bea7af$b91d67a0$a78cc5ce@thurman.com> Message-ID: <006401bea7b3$44d09ee0$a78cc5ce@thurman.com> Side note: the Redstone address provided I found matches Sam Khuri's home address in USWestDex.com. Scot Harkins (KA5KDU) | Systems Administrator, Thurman Ind, Bothell, WA North Bend, WA | Native Texan firmly planted in Western Washington scoth at bigfoot.com | SCA: Ld. Scot MacFin, Barony of Madrone, An Tir scoth at scn.org/msn.com | URL * * * * * * * * * * * * * * From the Listowner * * * * * * * * * * * * . To unsubscribe from this list, send a message to: majordomo at scn.org In the body of the message, type: unsubscribe scn ==== Messages posted on this list are also available on the web at: ==== * * * * * * * http://www.scn.org/volunteers/scn-l/ * * * * * * * From janossz at scn.org Wed May 26 15:33:10 1999 From: janossz at scn.org (Janos Szablya) Date: Wed, 26 May 1999 15:33:10 -0700 (PDT) Subject: Attorney In-Reply-To: <004501bea7ad$7890d110$a78cc5ce@thurman.com> Message-ID: I happen to be close personal friends with one of the U.S.'s leading cyber lawyers.... I the push is there....I will NOT ask this lawyer to represent us but I will ask ........ if it's worth the effort. I ask the question... Pursue? yes/no What is our case? specifics of spaming Who are we going to serve? (SUE) Pick a target who do we hate...? With this info I can ask intelligent questions. I would consider this opinion solid in the current atmosphere of the legal debates. I choose to protect the identity of this attorney because of this persons position in the cyber industry and/or government. (and/or so there would be no clues) Please remember my spelling stinks... Janos * * * * * * * * * * * * * * From the Listowner * * * * * * * * * * * * . To unsubscribe from this list, send a message to: majordomo at scn.org In the body of the message, type: unsubscribe scn ==== Messages posted on this list are also available on the web at: ==== * * * * * * * http://www.scn.org/volunteers/scn-l/ * * * * * * * From kurt Wed May 26 15:50:12 1999 From: kurt (Kurt Cockrum) Date: Wed, 26 May 1999 15:50:12 -0700 (PDT) Subject: Some stats on art333 activity on scn.org Message-ID: <199905262250.PAA12755@scn.org> mailing list Message-Id # of recipients ------------ ---------- --------------- fundraising <199905240601.XAA15098 at scn.org> 15 governance <199905240601.XAA15050 at scn.org> 3 hardware <199905240601.XAA15049 at scn.org> 33 local-computer-activists <199905240601.XAA15048 at scn.org> 59 outreach <199905240601.XAA15098 at scn.org> 18 policy <199905240601.XAA15046 at scn.org> 15 scn <199905240601.XAA15047 at scn.org> 69 scna-board <199905240601.XAA15047 at scn.org> 12 webmaster <199905240601.XAA15043 at scn.org> 4 webmasters <199905240601.XAA15048 at scn.org> 44 art333 hit 10 lists that we host, for a total of 272 recipients. As many folks are on more than one list, they saw the same message more than once. I got hit 3 times. I've got the evidence tucked away in a safe place, along with md5 checksums :) --kurt * * * * * * * * * * * * * * From the Listowner * * * * * * * * * * * * . To unsubscribe from this list, send a message to: majordomo at scn.org In the body of the message, type: unsubscribe scn ==== Messages posted on this list are also available on the web at: ==== * * * * * * * http://www.scn.org/volunteers/scn-l/ * * * * * * * From randy at scn.org Wed May 26 16:43:47 1999 From: randy at scn.org (Randy Groves) Date: Wed, 26 May 1999 16:43:47 -0700 Subject: Some stats on art333 activity on scn.org In-Reply-To: <199905262250.PAA12755@scn.org> Message-ID: <9905262343.AA28613@redwood.rt.cs.boeing.com> Frankly, we have enough on our plate right now to go chasing after this in a legal fashion. I know that this may be 'head in the sand' thinking, but I don't see any pay-off. I would definitely consider it if the episode was continuous AND it seriously affected our service in some way. We then would also have 'denial of service' grounds. But we can't get our present projects done. -randy * * * * * * * * * * * * * * From the Listowner * * * * * * * * * * * * . To unsubscribe from this list, send a message to: majordomo at scn.org In the body of the message, type: unsubscribe scn ==== Messages posted on this list are also available on the web at: ==== * * * * * * * http://www.scn.org/volunteers/scn-l/ * * * * * * * From scoth at scn.org Wed May 26 17:24:28 1999 From: scoth at scn.org (Scot Harkins on SCN.org) Date: Wed, 26 May 1999 17:24:28 -0700 Subject: Some stats on art333 activity on scn.org References: <9905262343.AA28613@redwood.rt.cs.boeing.com> Message-ID: <001201bea7d7$4996f630$a78cc5ce@thurman.com> Judging by the number of messages and the relative lack of affect on our systems I, too, would say it's not worth any further effort at this point beyond the (already sent) complaint to his (then current) ISP. As a future reference I would say we go after people who hit us beyond a certain threshold, such that their messages caused a significant load or burden on our systems and users. Repeat attacks, too. Any kind of DoS attacks, successful relays (not likely now). Along the repeat attacks line we should perhaps track notable events like this for future reference. If something turns up again within a certain period of time we can put them together and decide again on whether to take action. We aren't very likely to get any money out of this anyway with what we have and how much work it would take. Scot Scot Harkins (KA5KDU) | Systems Administrator, Thurman Ind, Bothell, WA North Bend, WA | Native Texan firmly planted in Western Washington scoth at bigfoot.com | SCA: Ld. Scot MacFin, Barony of Madrone, An Tir scoth at scn.org/msn.com | URL ----- Original Message ----- From: Randy Groves To: ; ; Sent: Wednesday, May 26, 1999 4:43 PM Subject: Re: Some stats on art333 activity on scn.org > Frankly, we have enough on our plate right now to go chasing after this in > a legal fashion. I know that this may be 'head in the sand' thinking, but > I don't see any pay-off. > > I would definitely consider it if the episode was continuous AND it > seriously affected our service in some way. We then would also have > 'denial of service' grounds. > > But we can't get our present projects done. > > -randy > * * * * * * * * * * * * * * From the Listowner * * * * * * * * * * * * > . To unsubscribe from this list, send a message to: > majordomo at scn.org In the body of the message, type: > unsubscribe hardware > END > > * * * * * * * * * * * * * * From the Listowner * * * * * * * * * * * * . To unsubscribe from this list, send a message to: majordomo at scn.org In the body of the message, type: unsubscribe scn ==== Messages posted on this list are also available on the web at: ==== * * * * * * * http://www.scn.org/volunteers/scn-l/ * * * * * * * From karyn at accessone.com Wed May 26 22:58:29 1999 From: karyn at accessone.com (Karyn Quinlan) Date: Wed, 26 May 1999 22:58:29 -0700 Subject: scn In-Reply-To: <199905270116.SAA01468@scn.org> Message-ID: <3.0.1.32.19990526225829.0099b100@mail.accessone.com> >I don't think replying to {remove,abuse,postmaster}@somedomain.zork is >very effective, except to make the spam-recipient feel a little better. >But changing ISP's for a spammer is just as routine as changing underwear, >except that it probably happens more often. It's just one of the activities >of running a business. The idea that it causes pain and expense to the >spammer is wishful thinking, IMO. If you're responding to my comments, you got it wrong. (But I see I could have been clearer...) I was talking about the marketing used by ISPs of giving trial offers etc. This is like heaven to a spammer. The spammers incur no costs whatsoever and move on as soon as they get "caught," or sooner. Like you say, like changing their underwear... Spam should be sent back to those who encourage it by way of their trial offers and other low or no risk invitations to spam! Send it back -- but certainly not to the spammer! (they will be only too happy to harvest your address). Send spam back by way of the offending ISP (use abuse@ or postmaster@). Clog up *their* system. If everybody did it, these companies (the offending ISPs) may start to feel the costs of their marketing ploys. Enuff said? >I routinely report spam to abuse (see below). It takes 2 seconds. However, >the problem of spam is much larger. The marketing used by such companies >(free email, trial offers etc.) is a huge part of the problem. Spammers can move >on very quickly to yet another free and/or trial account. Personally, I do >not think spam is a trivial problem. It has real costs. I suggest that at a >minimum people report all spam to abuse at _____.com or postmaster at ____.com >If the marketing efforts of these companies start to clog up *their* system, >things may change. Just a thought... * * * * * * * * * * * * * * From the Listowner * * * * * * * * * * * * . To unsubscribe from this list, send a message to: majordomo at scn.org In the body of the message, type: unsubscribe scn ==== Messages posted on this list are also available on the web at: ==== * * * * * * * http://www.scn.org/volunteers/scn-l/ * * * * * * * From jj at scn.org Thu May 27 00:32:03 1999 From: jj at scn.org (J. Johnson) Date: Thu, 27 May 1999 00:32:03 -0700 (PDT) Subject: scn [spam] In-Reply-To: <3.0.1.32.19990526225829.0099b100@mail.accessone.com> Message-ID: > >But changing ISP's for a spammer is just as routine as changing underwear, > >except that it probably happens more often. ... > Spam should be sent back to .... the offending ISP (use abuse@ or > postmaster@). Clog up *their* system. If everybody did it, these companies > (the offending ISPs) may start to feel the costs of their marketing ploys. Should _not_. Please note that "these companies" (the spammers?) and "the offending ISPs" are NOT the same; and unless, and _until_, an ISP proves unresponsive it is better to get their cooperation. And that means not making things harder for them. (After all, there have been times when SCN was "the offending ISP".) Also note that spammers can run out of "clean" ISPs to change to. I saw that about two years ago when we were getting hit by one particular spammer out of Florida on a regular basis. (Actually using SCN to relay spam elsewhere.) I started monitoring his activities closely, and jumping on him so often that I was getting to know the staff of the NSP (National Service Provider) that provides the long-haul trunks that most of the ISPs connect to. Even to getting him cut-off in mid-session, with strong messages to the ISP. Florida must have gotten too hot--or too lean?--for him, as the last I saw of him was from an ISP in Iowa--just before his account there was cancelled. === JJ ================================================================= * * * * * * * * * * * * * * From the Listowner * * * * * * * * * * * * . To unsubscribe from this list, send a message to: majordomo at scn.org In the body of the message, type: unsubscribe scn ==== Messages posted on this list are also available on the web at: ==== * * * * * * * http://www.scn.org/volunteers/scn-l/ * * * * * * * From jj at scn.org Thu May 27 01:05:02 1999 From: jj at scn.org (J. Johnson) Date: Thu, 27 May 1999 01:05:02 -0700 (PDT) Subject: Attorney (and "AGO") In-Reply-To: Message-ID: Whether SCN takes this spammer to court is a matter best left to the Board. Though each individual recipient of spam could sue on their own behalf. But--before anyone gets too excited about suing anyone: please look at the Washington State Attorney General's Office ("AGO") website (www.wa.gov/ago), which has text of the law, links to anti-spam sites, and directions on how to file a complaint. (Besides, I'm getting tired of all this hooting and hollering. I want to see some of the penguins dive in.) === JJ ================================================================= * * * * * * * * * * * * * * From the Listowner * * * * * * * * * * * * . To unsubscribe from this list, send a message to: majordomo at scn.org In the body of the message, type: unsubscribe scn ==== Messages posted on this list are also available on the web at: ==== * * * * * * * http://www.scn.org/volunteers/scn-l/ * * * * * * * From karyn at accessone.com Thu May 27 09:33:35 1999 From: karyn at accessone.com (Karyn Quinlan) Date: Thu, 27 May 1999 09:33:35 -0700 Subject: scn [spam] In-Reply-To: References: <3.0.1.32.19990526225829.0099b100@mail.accessone.com> Message-ID: <3.0.1.32.19990527093335.0099c100@mail.accessone.com> > Should _not_. Please note that "these companies" (the spammers?) and >"the offending ISPs" are NOT the same; and unless, and _until_, an ISP >proves unresponsive it is better to get their cooperation. And that means >not making things harder for them. (After all, there have been times when >SCN was "the offending ISP".) Okay, last try... Some ISPs, through their marketing ploys, actually encourage spammers. This is the point. Did you read the abuse reply? (See below.) Conscientious ISPs appreciate spam reports. And big commercial ISPs that spawn *huge* amounts of spam need to take responsibility for what they do to encourage spamming. They do indeed offend. I'm out of this discussion, too many straw man arguments... >From: "Friendly Email" >To: "Karyn Quinlan" >Subject: RE: copier & laser printer supplies advertisement >Date: Mon, 24 May 1999 23:44:20 -0400 >X-MSMail-Priority: Normal >X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V4.72.3110.3 >Importance: Normal >Content-Length: 5691 > >Hi! >  >Thank you for drawing the abuse to our attention. The matter has been >addressed and the appropriate action has been taken. It is our policy >not to allow SPAM and when we are alerted of the abuse of one of our >accounts, we move swiftly to ensure that the offending account is dealt >with accoringly. We've deleted this account for its offenses against our >Terms of Service. Again, thank you for notifying us. :) >  >================================== >Free e-mail located at http://friendlyemail.com >Cool domains with easy web and pop access. >voice-mail & fax : (619) 839-3873 * * * * * * * * * * * * * * From the Listowner * * * * * * * * * * * * . To unsubscribe from this list, send a message to: majordomo at scn.org In the body of the message, type: unsubscribe scn ==== Messages posted on this list are also available on the web at: ==== * * * * * * * http://www.scn.org/volunteers/scn-l/ * * * * * * * From kurt at grogatch.seaslug.org Thu May 27 10:06:08 1999 From: kurt at grogatch.seaslug.org (Kurt Cockrum) Date: Thu, 27 May 1999 10:06:08 -0700 Subject: fwd: REVIEW: "Digital Democracy", Cynthia J. Alexander/Leslie A. Pal Message-ID: <199905271706.KAA18119@grogatch.seaslug.org> Culled from Risks Digest 20.41 : Date: Tue, 18 May 1999 08:40:11 -0800 From: Rob Slade Subject: REVIEW: "Digital Democracy", Cynthia J. Alexander/Leslie A. Pal BKDGTLDM.RVW 990326 "Digital Democracy", Cynthia J. Alexander/Leslie A. Pal, 1998, 0-19-541359-8, U$26.50 %E Cynthia J. Alexander %E Leslie A. Pal %C 70 Wynford Drive, Don Mills, Ontario M3C 1J9 %D 1998 %G 0-19-541359-8 %I Oxford University Press %O U$26.50 212-679-7300 %P 237 p. %T "Digital Democracy: Policy and Politics in the Wired World" As a techie, I more comfortable with the "hard" sciences with provable outcomes, such as the "running code" (1) of the Internet. However, as one interested in the social aspects of the net, I have to respect the softer sciences, since without "rough consensus" (2) there would be neither protocol standards, nor the real heart of the communications that goes on. As Dimwiddy and Bunkum state (3), though, PoliSci is so soft as to be positively mushy. Right from the beginning (4) the text is heavily larded with footnotes, which sometimes threaten to overpower the essays they are supposed to support (5). Oddly, though, these footnotes do not give any impression of the strength of the material in the book, quite the contrary. Instead, they tend to lend credence to the statement that 94.3% of all statistics are made up on the spot (6). The content of the book tends to be strangely unformed, with statements ranging between unsupported bombast that we are simply assumed to accept, to citations of studies without much discussion of relevance or validity. After an introduction, there is a piece on "social forces in the hypermedia environment" that seems to want to talk about economics, a discussion of national security, and something looking at the national or global information infrastructure. None of these pieces, and, indeed, nothing in the book, seems to have any real idea of the technology involved, or the implications of the technology. A look at women on the net states that "Few will argue the impact of written language or--many centuries later--the printing press in shaping new societies" (7) while blithely ignoring the fact that we have very little idea of what those impacts might have been. Leslie Pal's own contribution, examining the outcry over the Communications Decency Act, seems to have the greatest understanding of modern communications systems, but even there (8) does not comprehend that the technical aspects of "flooding" algorithms and dynamic rerouting were what forced commercial services to lobby against the bill. The paper on teledemocracy bemoans the fact that lack of a touch tone phone disenfranchises a massive 5% of the population (9), while ignoring as insignificant a 12% disparity in polling results (10). His lauding of Ted White's telephone polling (11) was of particular interest to me, since I live in White's riding and a) didn't get a pin, b) could have reproduced White's polling system using local technology at far lower cost to both constituents and the government (12). There is a pedestrian piece on intellectual property. Then there is the mandatory article on pornography. (Can we have a Rimm shot? Thank you.) The Rimm "study" (13), and another equally suspect, categorize a bunch of feelthy peechers, and we are then told that there is a clear benefit for regulation of pornography (14). The essay on privacy takes for granted that you cannot have freedom without privacy (15), ignoring items like David Brin's "The Transparent Society" which proposes a remarkably free environment almost completely devoid of privacy (16). The article also decries identification numbers of all types, and then goes on (17) to laud public key encryption, seemingly unaware that a public key is a number. Neither the discussion of health care nor that of indigenous people really looks at social aspects of the technology. This seems to be my week for dumping on compatriots (18). However, my rabid nationalism does not extend so far as to defend those resident in my country when they don't know what they are talking about, and this book seems to be almost completely devoid of experience of the technology under examination. (1) Dave Clark (of MIT), IETF Conference, 1992 (2) ibid (3) I made them up, of course. (4) Well, I suppose not; there are no footnotes in the acknowledgement; but the first one comes in the second paragraph of the preface on page xii. (5) They never actually do. (6) This figure is embedded in one of my brother's sigblocks: I think he made it up. (7) p. 88 (8) p. 111 (9) p. 140 (10) p. 135 (11) p. 136 (12) White used Maritime T&T, had to spend $11,000 setting up a single poll, and it cost people $1.95 per time to vote. A PC based system could have, at the time, been established for about $5,000 altogether, and could have been reused at any time for further polling. (13) lucky, eh? (14) p. 176. I'm not exactly on the side of pornography, but there are a few steps missing in the proof, here. (15) p. 181 (16) cf. BKTRASOC.RVW (17) p. 187 (18) See also "Roadkill on the Information Highway" (BKRKOTIH.RVW) copyright Robert M. Slade, 1999 BKDGTLDM.RVW 990326 rslade at vcn.bc.ca rslade at sprint.ca slade at victoria.tc.ca p1 at canada.com http://victoria.tc.ca/techrev or http://sun.soci.niu.edu/~rslade --kurt * * * * * * * * * * * * * * From the Listowner * * * * * * * * * * * * . To unsubscribe from this list, send a message to: majordomo at scn.org In the body of the message, type: unsubscribe scn ==== Messages posted on this list are also available on the web at: ==== * * * * * * * http://www.scn.org/volunteers/scn-l/ * * * * * * * From jj at scn.org Thu May 27 17:05:09 1999 From: jj at scn.org (J. Johnson) Date: Thu, 27 May 1999 17:05:09 -0700 (PDT) Subject: scn [spam] In-Reply-To: <3.0.1.32.19990527093335.0099c100@mail.accessone.com> Message-ID: Perhaps I need to point out that what Karen said and what I said are not in conflict, _provided_ that one distinguishes between ISPs that are responsible and responsive (albeit glacially), and those that are not. I am quite willing to condone the reverse spamming of the latter. But I cannot condone the automatic reverse spamming of an ISP who just happened to carry (and possibly quite innocently) a spam message. Especially as spammers often use fictitious headers (i.e., return addresses). In the best case this "only" jams the postmaster (or 'root') account on your own system. Worse, you may end up dumping on a totally innocent user/ISP. If a user has sufficient skill to determine the ISP that a spammer actually used to connect to the Internet, then the most effective action to take is to _forward_ the spam, with "full headers", to that ISP so they can identify the source. If the user does not have that much skill (i.e., most users) then the best action is probably to just delete the message. === JJ ================================================================= * * * * * * * * * * * * * * From the Listowner * * * * * * * * * * * * . To unsubscribe from this list, send a message to: majordomo at scn.org In the body of the message, type: unsubscribe scn ==== Messages posted on this list are also available on the web at: ==== * * * * * * * http://www.scn.org/volunteers/scn-l/ * * * * * * * From spt at scn.org Fri May 28 11:12:54 1999 From: spt at scn.org (Seattle Public Theater) Date: Fri, 28 May 1999 11:12:54 -0700 (PDT) Subject: IP menu Message-ID: Rod et al: Today, I tested the cd using the /web.root/ path, and it did change, showing pwd /web/. I do swear on my user's manual that when I did this the day I complained, it did not work. Maybe someone should pay attention to the rest of this file menu. I have never gotten the setweb to work. Never, ever. Today on testing it said, /.ipweb files exists, etc. But then when I input web, it said this file did not exist. Thus, copyweb and moveweb don't work at all. I think these should be fixed and/or removed until fixed. Then, IPs will have to learn to use the copy command, which does work, or e and replacing text with new, to update their sites. Barb * * * * * * * * * * * * * * From the Listowner * * * * * * * * * * * * . To unsubscribe from this list, send a message to: majordomo at scn.org In the body of the message, type: unsubscribe scn ==== Messages posted on this list are also available on the web at: ==== * * * * * * * http://www.scn.org/volunteers/scn-l/ * * * * * * * From bb615 at scn.org Fri May 28 12:36:19 1999 From: bb615 at scn.org (Rod Clark) Date: Fri, 28 May 1999 12:36:19 -0700 (PDT) Subject: IP menu In-Reply-To: Message-ID: Barb, Using the IP Menu is frustrating enough that something should be done about it. The IP Menu was supposed to help with several things, when the Information Providers didn't have access to the Unix shell. (They all do, now.) First, display a handy menu to remind people of what functions are available, and what the names of the commands are to do them. Second, substitute some friendlier command names for some of the Unix command names. Third, limit people to using a basic set of commands that probably wouldn't mess things up too badly when used from the menu (which does a little error checking, etc.). All of the IPs can use the shell directly now. (Type "shell" at the Your Choice --> prompt, and then type "exit" to go back to the menus.) I wonder whether it might be better to make a help screen that you could call up from the shell if and when you need it (say, by typing "help") that would remind you of the basic commands, but otherwise wouldn't be obtrusive. Maybe the IP Menu should be more of an introduction to using the real Unix commands than it is now, instead of a complete replacement for access to the Unix prompt. Generally speaking, the real commands also work when you type them in on the IP menu, even though they're not listed on the screen along with the nicer English equivalents. So it might be better to add the underlying "cp", "mv", "rm", "ls" syntax of the Unix commands onto the IP menu, instead of using only the "copy", "move", "delete", "list" equivalents and other made-up stuff that doesn't carry over when you go to the shell. Would you be comfortable using the shell directly, if a reasonable help screen, or set of help screens, were made available? You'd have to type things like cp some.file /web/arts/spt instead of typing "copy" and then following the prompts that come up asking for the file name and the destination. Rod * * * * * * * * * * * * * * From the Listowner * * * * * * * * * * * * . To unsubscribe from this list, send a message to: majordomo at scn.org In the body of the message, type: unsubscribe scn ==== Messages posted on this list are also available on the web at: ==== * * * * * * * http://www.scn.org/volunteers/scn-l/ * * * * * * * From jmabel at saltmine.com Fri May 28 12:46:46 1999 From: jmabel at saltmine.com (Joe Mabel) Date: Fri, 28 May 1999 12:46:46 -0700 Subject: IP menu Message-ID: <01BEA908.26428A00.jmabel@saltmine.com> & for that matter there is nothing that stops us from making shell script files such as one with the name "copy" that prompts you appropriately, gets the arguments, then calls cp, etc. You can add "friendly" commands to a unix shell. -----Original Message----- From: Rod Clark [SMTP:bb615 at scn.org] Sent: Friday, May 28, 1999 12:36 PM To: Seattle Public Theater Cc: scn at scn.org; webmasters at scn.org Subject: Re: IP menu Barb, Using the IP Menu is frustrating enough that something should be done about it. The IP Menu was supposed to help with several things, when the Information Providers didn't have access to the Unix shell. (They all do, now.) First, display a handy menu to remind people of what functions are available, and what the names of the commands are to do them. Second, substitute some friendlier command names for some of the Unix command names. Third, limit people to using a basic set of commands that probably wouldn't mess things up too badly when used from the menu (which does a little error checking, etc.). All of the IPs can use the shell directly now. (Type "shell" at the Your Choice --> prompt, and then type "exit" to go back to the menus.) I wonder whether it might be better to make a help screen that you could call up from the shell if and when you need it (say, by typing "help") that would remind you of the basic commands, but otherwise wouldn't be obtrusive. Maybe the IP Menu should be more of an introduction to using the real Unix commands than it is now, instead of a complete replacement for access to the Unix prompt. Generally speaking, the real commands also work when you type them in on the IP menu, even though they're not listed on the screen along with the nicer English equivalents. So it might be better to add the underlying "cp", "mv", "rm", "ls" syntax of the Unix commands onto the IP menu, instead of using only the "copy", "move", "delete", "list" equivalents and other made-up stuff that doesn't carry over when you go to the shell. Would you be comfortable using the shell directly, if a reasonable help screen, or set of help screens, were made available? You'd have to type things like cp some.file /web/arts/spt instead of typing "copy" and then following the prompts that come up asking for the file name and the destination. Rod * * * * * * * * * * * * * * From the Listowner * * * * * * * * * * * * . To unsubscribe from this list, send a message to: majordomo at scn.org In the body of the message, type: unsubscribe webmasters Messages posted on this list are available on the Web at: http://www.scn.org/volunteers/webmasters/webmasters-l/ * * * * * * * * * * * * * * From the Listowner * * * * * * * * * * * * . To unsubscribe from this list, send a message to: majordomo at scn.org In the body of the message, type: unsubscribe scn ==== Messages posted on this list are also available on the web at: ==== * * * * * * * http://www.scn.org/volunteers/scn-l/ * * * * * * * From bb615 at scn.org Fri May 28 15:22:07 1999 From: bb615 at scn.org (Rod Clark) Date: Fri, 28 May 1999 15:22:07 -0700 (PDT) Subject: IP menu In-Reply-To: Message-ID: > ... I have never gotten the setweb to work. Never, ever. Today > on testing it said, > /.ipweb files exists, etc. But then when I > input web, it said this file did not exist. > > Thus, copyweb and moveweb don't work at all. I think these should > be fixed and/or removed until fixed. Barb, The old setweb* shell scripts didn't work very well. They didn't do much error checking on the input, and didn't print a message even if they did find something wrong, just failed silently and let you discover that on your own later. I've replaced them with some Perl scripts that don't do much more, but at least they should be a little more forgiving of user input, check the input a bit more and display a help message if they can't create the intended link. This should work better now. Let me know if you still have any problems with it. Rod * * * * * * * * * * * * * * From the Listowner * * * * * * * * * * * * . To unsubscribe from this list, send a message to: majordomo at scn.org In the body of the message, type: unsubscribe scn ==== Messages posted on this list are also available on the web at: ==== * * * * * * * http://www.scn.org/volunteers/scn-l/ * * * * * * * From bb615 at scn.org Fri May 28 18:07:57 1999 From: bb615 at scn.org (Rod Clark) Date: Fri, 28 May 1999 18:07:57 -0700 (PDT) Subject: IP menu In-Reply-To: <01BEA908.26428A00.jmabel@saltmine.com> Message-ID: > & for that matter there is nothing that stops us from making shell > script files such as one with the name "copy" that prompts you > appropriately, gets the arguments, then calls cp, etc. You can add > "friendly" commands to a unix shell. Joe, It would be a nice project for someone to do, and it's not rocket science, so various people could do it. Here's most of the current list of IP Menu commands, in the command format that the IP Menu program uses, in case anyone is curious. What would be your estimate of the time needed, if we wanted to put this on a project list? Rod home cmd=cd $HOME work cmd=cd $HOME/work cd cmd=cd prompt=Go_to_the_directory pwd cmd=pwd ls cmd=pwd;ls arg=-CFA | cmd=more dir cmd=pwd;ls arg=-Flags | cmd=more mkdir cmd=mkdir prompt=Create_a_new_directory_named rmdir cmd=rmdir prompt=Delete_the_directory cpdir cmd=cp arg=-ir prompt=Copy_this_directory prompt=To_a_new_directory_named cp cmd=cp arg=-i prompt=Copy_the_file prompt=To_(new_filename_or_directory_name) mv cmd=mv arg=-i prompt=Move_the_file prompt=To_(new_filename_or_directory_name) rm cmd=rm arg=-i prompt=Delete_the_file more cmd=more prompt=(Space_bar_to_page,_Q_quits)_Display_the_file diff cmd=diff prompt=Show_differences_between_this_file prompt=and_this_file grep cmd=fgrep prompt=Phrase_to_find prompt=Files_to_search_(example:_these*.html_*.txt) sort cmd=sort prompt=Input_file arg=-o prompt=Output_file e cmd=/usr/local/FreePort/lib/bin/editor prompt=Edit_the_file chmod cmd=chmod prompt=Permissions prompt=File_(or_directory) chgrp cmd=chgrp prompt=Change_group_to prompt=File_(or_directory) t2html cmd=txt2html.pl prompt=Input_(text)_file arg=> prompt=Output_(HTML)_file fplynx cmd=/usr/local/FreePort/bin/fplynx prompt=file_(example:_/web.root/news/index.html) gzip cmd=gzip prompt=Compress_(gzip)_the_file gunzip cmd=gunzip prompt=Uncompress_(gunzip)_the_file zmore cmd=zmore prompt=Display_the_file df cmd=pwd;df arg=. du cmd=pwd;du | cmd=more usedtot cmd=pwd;du arg=-s $arg=HOME code cmd=uuencode prompt=File_to_encode prompt=Name_to_call_it_at_remote_end arg=> prompt=Output_file decode cmd=uudecode prompt=File_to_decode w cmd=w |sort|more who cmd=who |sort|more ps cmd=ps arg=g|more ftp cmd=ftp prompt=Remote_host_to_connect_to dak cmd=kermit arg=-s prompt=File dax cmd=xmodem arg=-stlk prompt=File day cmd=sb arg=-ka prompt=File daz cmd=sz -a -w 1024 prompt=File dbk cmd=kermit arg=-is prompt=File dbx cmd=xmodem arg=-sblk prompt=File dby cmd=sb arg=-kb prompt=File dbz cmd=sz -b -w 1024 prompt=File uak cmd=kermit arg=-r uax cmd=xmodem arg=-rtlk prompt=File uay cmd=rb arg=-a uaz cmd=rz arg=-a ubk cmd=kermit arg=-ir ubx cmd=xmodem arg=-rblk prompt=File uby cmd=rb arg=-b ubz cmd=rz arg=-b * * * * * * * * * * * * * * From the Listowner * * * * * * * * * * * * . To unsubscribe from this list, send a message to: majordomo at scn.org In the body of the message, type: unsubscribe scn ==== Messages posted on this list are also available on the web at: ==== * * * * * * * http://www.scn.org/volunteers/scn-l/ * * * * * * * From steve at GroupWorks.org Sat May 29 03:01:19 1999 From: steve at GroupWorks.org (Steve Guest) Date: Sat, 29 May 1999 06:01:19 -0400 (EDT) Subject: IP menu In-Reply-To: Message-ID: Hi Folks Nice that you are showing an interest here. Rod I need to work with you on this. Today I had a volunteer agree to work on putting up some web pages on what and how an IP can do on SCN. So if we start to change this in any way I would like to know and so would Diana. I am also trying to contact Mary Waters about the help pages. Steve -=- -=-=- -=- -=-=- -=- -=-=- -=- -=-=- -=- -=-=- -=- Melissa & Steve Guest (425) 653 7353 Info Provider & Mentor Coordinators 8am to 11pm PST Seattle Community Network http://www.scn.org "Supporting People and Communities with Free Internet Services" * * * * * * * * * * * * * * From the Listowner * * * * * * * * * * * * . To unsubscribe from this list, send a message to: majordomo at scn.org In the body of the message, type: unsubscribe scn ==== Messages posted on this list are also available on the web at: ==== * * * * * * * http://www.scn.org/volunteers/scn-l/ * * * * * * * From bb615 at scn.org Sun May 30 15:23:23 1999 From: bb615 at scn.org (Rod Clark) Date: Sun, 30 May 1999 15:23:23 -0700 (PDT) Subject: IP menu In-Reply-To: Message-ID: > Nice that you are showing an interest here. Rod I need to work with you > on this. Today I had a volunteer agree to work on putting up some web > pages on what and how an IP can do on SCN. So if we start to change this Steve, How to encourage, direct and organize people's efforts to build SCN is something that we've never actually codified. Maybe it is and maybe it isn't time to do that more formally. For one approach, that seems to be working for the Open Directory Project, see http://www.dmozed.org/ Rod Clark * * * * * * * * * * * * * * From the Listowner * * * * * * * * * * * * . To unsubscribe from this list, send a message to: majordomo at scn.org In the body of the message, type: unsubscribe scn ==== Messages posted on this list are also available on the web at: ==== * * * * * * * http://www.scn.org/volunteers/scn-l/ * * * * * * * From steve at advocate.net Mon May 31 18:48:31 1999 From: steve at advocate.net (Steve) Date: Mon, 31 May 1999 17:48:31 -0800 Subject: Web design Message-ID: <199906010051.RAA15048@scn.org> x-no-archive: yes ================= The Top Ten New Mistakes of Web Design Jakob Nielsen's Alertbox 5/30/99 The "top ten" design mistakes I identified in 1996 are still bad for Web usability and are still found on many websites. So in that sense, not much has changed over the last three years. But unfortunately new Web technology and new applications for the Web have introduced an entirely new class of mistakes. Here are the ten worst. 1. Breaking or Slowing Down the Back Button The Back button is the lifeline of the Web user and the second-most used navigation feature (after following hypertext links). Users happily know that they can try anything on the Web and always be saved by a click or two on Back to return them to familiar territory. Except, of course, for those sites that break Back by committing one of these design sins: ...opening a new browser window (see mistake #2) ...using an immediate redirect: every time the user clicks Back, the browser returns to a page that bounces the user forward to the undesired location ...prevents caching such that the Back navigation requires a fresh trip to the server; all hypertext navigation should be sub-second and this goes double for backtracking 2. Opening New Browser Windows Opening up new browser windows is like a vacuum cleaner sales person who starts a visit by emptying an ash tray on the customer's carpet. Don't pollute my screen with any more windows, thanks (particularly since current operating systems have miserable window management). If I want a new window, I will open it myself! Designers open new browser windows on the theory that it keeps users on their site. But even disregarding the user-hostile message implied in taking over the user's machine, the strategy is self-defeating since it disables the Back button which is the normal way users return to previous sites. Users often don't notice that a new window has opened, especially if they are using a small monitor where the windows are maximized to fill up the screen. So a user who tries to return to the origin will be confused by a grayed out Back button. 3. Non-Standard Use of GUI Widgets Consistency is one of the most powerful usability principles: when things always behave the same, users don't have to worry about what will happen. Instead, they know what will happen based on earlier experience. Every time you release an apple over Sir Isaac Newton, it will drop on his head. That's good. The more users' expectations prove right, the more they will feel in control of the system and the more they will like it. And the more the system breaks users' expectations, the more they will feel insecure. Oops, maybe if I let go of this apple, it will turn into a tomato and jump a mile into the sky. Interaction consistency is an additional reason it's wrong to open new browser windows: the standard result of clicking a link is that the destination page replaces the origination page in the same browser window. Anything else is a violation of the users' expectations and makes them feel insecure in their mastery of the Web. Currently, the worst consistency violations on the Web are found in the use of GUI widgets such as radio buttons and checkboxes. The appropriate behavior of these design elements are defined in the Windows UI standard, the Macintosh UI standard, and the Java UI standard. Which of these standards to follow depends on the platform used by the majority of your users (good bet: Windows), but it hardly matters for the most basic widgets since all the standards have close-to-identical rules. For example, the rules for radio buttons state that they are used to select one among a set of options but that the choice of options does not take effect until the user has confirmed the choice by clicking an OK button. Unfortunately, I have seen many websites where radio buttons are used as action buttons that have an immediate result when clicked. Such wanton deviations from accepted interface standards make the Web harder to use. 4. Lack of Biographies My first Web studies in 1994 showed that users want to know the people behind information on the Web. In particular, biographies and photographs of the authors help make the Web a less impersonal place and increase trust. Personality and point-of-view often wins over anonymous bits coming over the wire. Yet many sites still don't use columnists and avoid by-lines on their articles. Even sites with by-lines often forget the link to the author's biography and a way for the user to find other articles by the same author. It is particularly bad when a by-line is made into a mailto: link instead of a link to the author's biography. Two reasons: ...it is much more common for a reader to want to know more about an author (including finding the writer's other articles) than it is for the reader to want to contact the author - sure, contact info is often a good part of the biography, but it should not be the primary or only piece of data about the author ...it breaks the conventions of the Web when clicking on blue underlined text spawns an email message instead of activating a hypertext link to a new page; such inconsistency reduces usability by making the Web less predictable 5. Lack of Archives Old information is often good information and can be useful to readers. Even when new information is more valuable than old information, there is almost always some value to the old stuff, and it is very cheap to keep it online. I estimate that having archives may add about 10% to the cost of running a site but increase its usefulness by about 50%. Archives are also necessary as the only way to eliminate linkrot and thus encourage other sites to link to you. 6. Moving Pages to New URLs Anytime a page moves, you break any incoming links from other sites. Why hurt the people who send you free customer referrals? 7. Headlines That Make No Sense Out of Context Headlines and other microcontent must be written very differently for the Web than for old media: they are actionable items that serve as UI elements and should help users navigate. Headlines are often removed from the context of the full page and used in tables of content (e.g., home pages or category pages) and in search engine results. In either case the writing needs to be very plain and meet two goals: ...tell users what's at the other end of the link with no guesswork required ...protect users from following the link if they would not be interested in the destination page (so no teasers - they may work once or twice to drive up traffic, but in the long run they will make users abandon the site and reduce its credibility) 8. Jumping at the Latest Internet Buzzword The web is awash in money and people who proclaim to have found the way to salvation for all the sites that continue to lose money. Push, community, chat, free email, 3D sitemaps, auctions - you know the drill. But there is no magic bullet. Most Internet buzzwords have some substance and might bring small benefits to those few websites that can use them appropriately. Most of the time, most websites will be hurt by implementing the latest buzzword. The opportunity cost is high from focusing attention on a fad instead of spending the time, money, and management bandwidth on improving basic customer service and usability. There will be a new buzzword next month. Count on it. But don't jump at it just because Jupiter writes a report about it. 9. Slow Server Response Times Slow response times are the worst offender against Web usability: in my survey of the original "top-ten" mistakes, major sites had a truly horrifying 84% violation score with respect to the response time rule. Bloated graphic design was the original offender in the response time area. Some sites still have too many graphics or too big graphics; or they use applets where plain or Dynamic HTML would have done the trick. So I am not giving up my crusade to minimize download times. The growth in web-based applications, e-commerce, and personalization often means that each page view must be computed on the fly. As a result, the experienced delay in loading the page is determined not simply by the download delay (bad as it is) but also by the server performance. Sometimes building a page also involves connections to back-end mainframes or database servers, slowing down the process even further. Users don't care why response times are slow. All they know is that the site doesn't offer good service: slow response times often translate directly into a reduced level of trust and they always cause a loss of traffic as users take their business elsewhere. So invest in a fast server and get a performance expert to review your system architecture and code quality to optimize response times. 10. Anything That Looks Like Advertising Selective attention is very powerful, and Web users have learned to stop paying attention to any ads that get in the way of their goal-driven navigation. That's why click-through rates are being cut in half every year and why Web advertisements don't work. Unfortunately, users also ignore legitimate design elements that look like prevalent forms of advertising. After all, when you ignore something, you don't study it in detail to find out what it is. Therefore, it is best to avoid any designs that look like advertisements. The exact implications of this guideline will vary with new forms of ads; currently follow these rules: ...banner blindness means that users never fixate their eyes on anything that looks like a banner ad due to shape or position on the page ...animation avoidance makes users ignore areas with blinking or flashing text or other aggressive animations ...pop-up purges mean that users close pop-up windoids before they have even fully rendered; sometimes with great viciousness (a sort of getting-back-at-Geocities triumph). I don't want to ban pop-ups completely since they can sometimes be a productive part of an interface, but I advise making sure that there is an alternative way of using the site for users who never see the pop-ups. * * * * * * * * * * * * * * From the Listowner * * * * * * * * * * * * . To unsubscribe from this list, send a message to: majordomo at scn.org In the body of the message, type: unsubscribe scn ==== Messages posted on this list are also available on the web at: ==== * * * * * * * http://www.scn.org/volunteers/scn-l/ * * * * * * *