From ljbeedle at scn.org  Thu Jun 30 02:33:52 2011
From: ljbeedle at scn.org (ljbeedle at scn.org)
Date: Thu, 30 Jun 2011 05:33:52 -0400
Subject: SCN: RE: SCNA kaput -- irrevocably?
Message-ID: <380-22011643093352798@M2W107.mail2web.com>

I would hate to see SCN die totally.  I am not sure how many active users
we still have but I do have 4 non profits with directories on SCN that I
keep up.  I also still try to keep up the Spirituality menu.

What would it mean to our users if your group took over Doug?  

What does the SCN Constitution and By-laws say about the disposition of
assets if we were to dissolve SCN?

Having gone though this with a church I do know that not much is required
to reactive except for filing an up to date Constitution and By-laws and
the fee.  At least that was all we had to do for the church.  

Is there anyone left who can call a meeting of the members to approve any
actions?

Lois

Original Message:
-----------------
From: Douglas Schuler douglas at publicsphereproject.org
Date: Wed, 29 Jun 2011 21:07:36 -0700
To: randomgrace at gmail.com, alboss at sisypheans.org, al.boss at metrokc.gov,
kgillgren at igc.org, jj at scn.org, scn at scn.org, douglas at cpsr.org,
steve at advocate.net, jmabel at speakeasy.org, jimh at scn.org, ljbeedle at scn.org,
bb615 at scn.org, anamioka at gmail.com
Subject: SCNA kaput -- irrevocably?



After 10 years or so of inaction it looks like the SCN board finally  
ceased re-upping with the secretary of state.

I'm guessing that it would still be possible to re-initiate the  
organization if  anybody wanted to.  I'd be willing for the Public  
Sphere Project (a non-profit,  501.c.3 organization) to  absorb the  
assets (probably just the machine) to continue the operation of the  
machine.  I  think that my students could  take  some  degree of   
custodianship over  the machine as part of their civic  intelligence  
work.

-- Doug







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From randomgrace at gmail.com  Thu Jun 30 12:32:18 2011
From: randomgrace at gmail.com (Randy Groves)
Date: Thu, 30 Jun 2011 12:32:18 -0700
Subject: SCN: Re: RE: SCNA kaput -- irrevocably?
In-Reply-To: <04ce01cc375a$2b0f0250$812d06f0$@com>
References: <380-22011643093352798@M2W107.mail2web.com>
	<04ce01cc375a$2b0f0250$812d06f0$@com>
Message-ID: <BANLkTikewwbVkwREUuc=H8Mv14QFEC7DVA@mail.gmail.com>

I was a bit curious that Joel, Alan, and Ti were not included in the e-mail,
but forwarded it to them as soon as I saw it.

I think that it is a little early to start dancing on SCN's grave.

-randy

On Thu, Jun 30, 2011 at 12:16 PM, Steve Guest <steve at steve-guest.com> wrote:

> Hi Lois
> Having officially resigned from the SCNA board about 3 years ago I cannot
> tell you the current situation.  I do not see Joel or Ti listed in this
> email and they were still board members when I resigned.
>
> As for the disposal of the SCNA assets and funds the articles of
> incorporation, the constitution and the by-laws where appropriate were all
> very clear - these must all go to CPSR.  Having tried to change a small
> aspect of these by-laws to give the board the ability to perform a required
> and expected management function - and failing - I would expect these asset
> and fund dispersal requirements have not changed.  Therefore they cannot
> simply be transferred to another non-profit.
>
> The ACLU attorney who setup the rules did a great job.  I had discussions
> with four attorneys on ways to change these documents, including the one
> who
> did the original work.  There are copies of the documents on the web site
> should you need them.  I would have your own legal counsel look at these.
>
> Steve
>
> Dr. Steve Guest
> 206-364-5636
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: owner-scn at scn.org [mailto:owner-scn at scn.org] On Behalf Of
> ljbeedle at scn.org
> Sent: Thursday, June 30, 2011 2:34 AM
> To: douglas at publicsphereproject.org; randomgrace at gmail.com;
> alboss at sisypheans.org; al.boss at metrokc.gov; kgillgren at igc.org; jj at scn.org;
> scn at scn.org; douglas at cpsr.org; steve at advocate.net; jmabel at speakeasy.org;
> jimh at scn.org; bb615 at scn.org; anamioka at gmail.com
> Subject: SCN: RE: SCNA kaput -- irrevocably?
>
> I would hate to see SCN die totally.  I am not sure how many active users
> we still have but I do have 4 non profits with directories on SCN that I
> keep up.  I also still try to keep up the Spirituality menu.
>
> What would it mean to our users if your group took over Doug?
>
> What does the SCN Constitution and By-laws say about the disposition of
> assets if we were to dissolve SCN?
>
> Having gone though this with a church I do know that not much is required
> to reactive except for filing an up to date Constitution and By-laws and
> the fee.  At least that was all we had to do for the church.
>
> Is there anyone left who can call a meeting of the members to approve any
> actions?
>
> Lois
>
> Original Message:
> -----------------
> From: Douglas Schuler douglas at publicsphereproject.org
> Date: Wed, 29 Jun 2011 21:07:36 -0700
> To: randomgrace at gmail.com, alboss at sisypheans.org, al.boss at metrokc.gov,
> kgillgren at igc.org, jj at scn.org, scn at scn.org, douglas at cpsr.org,
> steve at advocate.net, jmabel at speakeasy.org, jimh at scn.org, ljbeedle at scn.org,
> bb615 at scn.org, anamioka at gmail.com
> Subject: SCNA kaput -- irrevocably?
>
>
>
> After 10 years or so of inaction it looks like the SCN board finally
> ceased re-upping with the secretary of state.
>
> I'm guessing that it would still be possible to re-initiate the
> organization if  anybody wanted to.  I'd be willing for the Public
> Sphere Project (a non-profit,  501.c.3 organization) to  absorb the
> assets (probably just the machine) to continue the operation of the
> machine.  I  think that my students could  take  some  degree of
> custodianship over  the machine as part of their civic  intelligence
> work.
>
> -- Doug
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> --------------------------------------------------------------------
> mail2web.com - What can On Demand Business Solutions do for you?
> http://link.mail2web.com/Business/SharePoint
>
>
> * * * * * * * * * * * * * *  From the Listowner  * * * * * * * * * * * *
> .       To unsubscribe from this list, send a message to:
> majordomo at scn.org               In the body of the message, type:
> unsubscribe scn
> ==essages posted on this list are also available on the web at: =* * * * *
> *
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>
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From randomgrace at gmail.com  Thu Jun 30 14:32:40 2011
From: randomgrace at gmail.com (Randy Groves)
Date: Thu, 30 Jun 2011 14:32:40 -0700
Subject: SCN: Re: RE: SCNA kaput -- irrevocably?
In-Reply-To: <C389351C-89A7-4B1B-8EB0-685806E08A13@publicsphereproject.org>
References: <380-22011643093352798@M2W107.mail2web.com>
	<04ce01cc375a$2b0f0250$812d06f0$@com>
	<BANLkTikewwbVkwREUuc=H8Mv14QFEC7DVA@mail.gmail.com>
	<C389351C-89A7-4B1B-8EB0-685806E08A13@publicsphereproject.org>
Message-ID: <BANLkTimK+bO7U+QwL4gsfGfFzEtsU8rVVA@mail.gmail.com>

You are right that there is little obvious happening.  However, I happen to
have 6 rack servers in my garage that SCNA picked up at a going out of
business sale, thanks to the eagle eye of Rhodes Heilman.  They have been
configured with Fedora and just lack the configuration of the serial console
(something I've been meaning to get to for way too long) to be able to be
installed at the library.

The skinny on the boxes:

1 x3350 - http://www-03.ibm.com/systems/x/hardware/rack/x3350/specs.html
2 x3250 - http://www.nexstor.co.uk/prod_pdfs/3250.pdf
3           -
http://www.supermicro.com/products/system/1u/5013/sys-5013c-m.cfm

The IBMs have been updated to hold at least one 500GB drive (a couple have
two - I'm not at home).  My not completed plan for these would be to move
our web and mail presence to new MUCH faster hardware, and have lots of
horsepower to add new capabilities.

The bad news about this is that we got these machines last year.  That's
part of the problem of having bought Sun gear - the stuff just won't quit!
And it is easy to ignore it.

So - I think SCN is doing OK in the hardware department.  If anything, this
note is extra stimulus to me to get that final step completed.  Not that
hardware will solve organizational issues ...

-randy

On Thu, Jun 30, 2011 at 1:19 PM, Douglas Schuler <
douglas at publicsphereproject.org> wrote:

>
> Randy et al,
>
> I don't  feel like I'm dancing on SCN's grave. On the contrary I'm
> interested in trying to help save it -- and to help identify new ways in
> which it  could  address its mission and principles.
>
> When I noticed that the paperwork hadn't been submitted with the state (
> http://www.scn.org/commnet/scn-inactive.pdf) I assumed that the
> organization had been abandoned.
>
> And while I admit that I could be wrong it seems that very little has been
> done with SCNA for several years and, as I've suggested in the past,  it
>  might be good to establish different  leadership.
>
> Randy or others, please bring us up to date on the situation.
>
> Thanks!
>
> -- Doug
>
>
> On Jun 30, 2011, at 12:32 PM, Randy Groves wrote:
>
> I was a bit curious that Joel, Alan, and Ti were not included in the
> e-mail, but forwarded it to them as soon as I saw it.
>
> I think that it is a little early to start dancing on SCN's grave.
>
> -randy
>
> On Thu, Jun 30, 2011 at 12:16 PM, Steve Guest <steve at steve-guest.com>wrote:
>
>> Hi Lois
>> Having officially resigned from the SCNA board about 3 years ago I cannot
>> tell you the current situation.  I do not see Joel or Ti listed in this
>> email and they were still board members when I resigned.
>>
>> As for the disposal of the SCNA assets and funds the articles of
>> incorporation, the constitution and the by-laws where appropriate were all
>> very clear - these must all go to CPSR.  Having tried to change a small
>> aspect of these by-laws to give the board the ability to perform a
>> required
>> and expected management function - and failing - I would expect these
>> asset
>> and fund dispersal requirements have not changed.  Therefore they cannot
>> simply be transferred to another non-profit.
>>
>> The ACLU attorney who setup the rules did a great job.  I had discussions
>> with four attorneys on ways to change these documents, including the one
>> who
>> did the original work.  There are copies of the documents on the web site
>> should you need them.  I would have your own legal counsel look at these.
>>
>> Steve
>>
>> Dr. Steve Guest
>> 206-364-5636
>>
>> -----Original Message-----
>> From: owner-scn at scn.org [mailto:owner-scn at scn.org] On Behalf Of
>> ljbeedle at scn.org
>> Sent: Thursday, June 30, 2011 2:34 AM
>> To: douglas at publicsphereproject.org; randomgrace at gmail.com;
>> alboss at sisypheans.org; al.boss at metrokc.gov; kgillgren at igc.org; jj at scn.org
>> ;
>> scn at scn.org; douglas at cpsr.org; steve at advocate.net; jmabel at speakeasy.org;
>> jimh at scn.org; bb615 at scn.org; anamioka at gmail.com
>> Subject: SCN: RE: SCNA kaput -- irrevocably?
>>
>> I would hate to see SCN die totally.  I am not sure how many active users
>> we still have but I do have 4 non profits with directories on SCN that I
>> keep up.  I also still try to keep up the Spirituality menu.
>>
>> What would it mean to our users if your group took over Doug?
>>
>> What does the SCN Constitution and By-laws say about the disposition of
>> assets if we were to dissolve SCN?
>>
>> Having gone though this with a church I do know that not much is required
>> to reactive except for filing an up to date Constitution and By-laws and
>> the fee.  At least that was all we had to do for the church.
>>
>> Is there anyone left who can call a meeting of the members to approve any
>> actions?
>>
>> Lois
>>
>> Original Message:
>> -----------------
>> From: Douglas Schuler douglas at publicsphereproject.org
>> Date: Wed, 29 Jun 2011 21:07:36 -0700
>> To: randomgrace at gmail.com, alboss at sisypheans.org, al.boss at metrokc.gov,
>> kgillgren at igc.org, jj at scn.org, scn at scn.org, douglas at cpsr.org,
>> steve at advocate.net, jmabel at speakeasy.org, jimh at scn.org, ljbeedle at scn.org,
>> bb615 at scn.org, anamioka at gmail.com
>> Subject: SCNA kaput -- irrevocably?
>>
>>
>>
>> After 10 years or so of inaction it looks like the SCN board finally
>> ceased re-upping with the secretary of state.
>>
>> I'm guessing that it would still be possible to re-initiate the
>> organization if  anybody wanted to.  I'd be willing for the Public
>> Sphere Project (a non-profit,  501.c.3 organization) to  absorb the
>> assets (probably just the machine) to continue the operation of the
>> machine.  I  think that my students could  take  some  degree of
>> custodianship over  the machine as part of their civic  intelligence
>> work.
>>
>> -- Doug
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> --------------------------------------------------------------------
>> mail2web.com - What can On Demand Business Solutions do for you?
>> http://link.mail2web.com/Business/SharePoint
>>
>>
>> * * * * * * * * * * * * * *  From the Listowner  * * * * * * * * * * * *
>> .       To unsubscribe from this list, send a message to:
>> majordomo at scn.org               In the body of the message, type:
>> unsubscribe scn
>> ==essages posted on this list are also available on the web at: =* * * * *
>> *
>> *     http://www.scn.org/volunteers/scn-l/     * * * * * * *
>>
>>
>
>  Douglas Schuler
> douglas at publicsphereproject.org
>
>
> ------------------------------------------------------------------------------
> Public Sphere Project
>      http://www.publicsphereproject.org/
>
> Liberating Voices!  A Pattern Language for Communication Revolution
> (project)
>      http://www.publicsphereproject.org/patterns/
>
> Liberating Voices!  A Pattern Language for Communication Revolution (book)
>      http://mitpress.mit.edu/catalog/item/default.asp?ttype=2&tid=11601
>
>
>
>
>
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From jmabel at speakeasy.org  Thu Jun 30 13:52:52 2011
From: jmabel at speakeasy.org (jmabel)
Date: Thu, 30 Jun 2011 13:52:52 -0700 (PDT)
Subject: SCN: Re: RE: SCNA kaput -- irrevocably?
In-Reply-To: <C389351C-89A7-4B1B-8EB0-685806E08A13@publicsphereproject.org>
References: <380-22011643093352798@M2W107.mail2web.com> <04ce01cc375a$2b0f0250$812d06f0$@com>
 <BANLkTikewwbVkwREUuc=H8Mv14QFEC7DVA@mail.gmail.com>
 <C389351C-89A7-4B1B-8EB0-685806E08A13@publicsphereproject.org>
Message-ID: <Pine.LNX.4.58.1106301348340.25320@shell2.speakeasy.net>

For the record: I continue to regularly update the Peace Heathens Crisis
Resource Directory on scn.org. It would be quite a pity if this site, at the
same URL for about 15 years now, were to have to change its location (let alone
if it went down).

A few years back several of us requested the then-board that they hold a proper
board election, rather than continue reappointing one another on a round-robin
basis. We were rebuffed and weren't interested enough to make it a fight and
attempt what would have amounted to a hostile takeover. Is it too late for a
solution like that? Does this failure to file render the existing structure
void?

Alternatively, if the assets go to CPSR, can CPSR simply pass them on to a new,
local group?

--------------------
Joe Mabel

On Thu, 30 Jun 2011, Douglas Schuler wrote:

>
> Randy et al,
>
> I don't  feel like I'm dancing on SCN's grave. On the contrary I'm
> interested in trying to help save it -- and to help identify new ways
> in which it  could  address its mission and principles.
>
> When I noticed that the paperwork hadn't been submitted with the state
> (http://www.scn.org/commnet/scn-inactive.pdf) I assumed that the
> organization had been abandoned.
>
> And while I admit that I could be wrong it seems that very little has
> been done with SCNA for several years and, as I've suggested in the
> past,  it  might be good to establish different  leadership.
>
> Randy or others, please bring us up to date on the situation.
>
> Thanks!
>
> -- Doug
>
>
> On Jun 30, 2011, at 12:32 PM, Randy Groves wrote:
>
> > I was a bit curious that Joel, Alan, and Ti were not included in the
> > e-mail, but forwarded it to them as soon as I saw it.
> >
> > I think that it is a little early to start dancing on SCN's grave.
> >
> > -randy
> >
> > On Thu, Jun 30, 2011 at 12:16 PM, Steve Guest <steve at steve-
> > guest.com> wrote:
> > Hi Lois
> > Having officially resigned from the SCNA board about 3 years ago I
> > cannot
> > tell you the current situation.  I do not see Joel or Ti listed in
> > this
> > email and they were still board members when I resigned.
> >
> > As for the disposal of the SCNA assets and funds the articles of
> > incorporation, the constitution and the by-laws where appropriate
> > were all
> > very clear - these must all go to CPSR.  Having tried to change a
> > small
> > aspect of these by-laws to give the board the ability to perform a
> > required
> > and expected management function - and failing - I would expect
> > these asset
> > and fund dispersal requirements have not changed.  Therefore they
> > cannot
> > simply be transferred to another non-profit.
> >
> > The ACLU attorney who setup the rules did a great job.  I had
> > discussions
> > with four attorneys on ways to change these documents, including the
> > one who
> > did the original work.  There are copies of the documents on the web
> > site
> > should you need them.  I would have your own legal counsel look at
> > these.
> >
> > Steve
> >
> > Dr. Steve Guest
> > 206-364-5636
> >
> > -----Original Message-----
> > From: owner-scn at scn.org [mailto:owner-scn at scn.org] On Behalf Of
> > ljbeedle at scn.org
> > Sent: Thursday, June 30, 2011 2:34 AM
> > To: douglas at publicsphereproject.org; randomgrace at gmail.com;
> > alboss at sisypheans.org; al.boss at metrokc.gov; kgillgren at igc.org; jj at scn.org
> > ;
> > scn at scn.org; douglas at cpsr.org; steve at advocate.net; jmabel at speakeasy.org
> > ;
> > jimh at scn.org; bb615 at scn.org; anamioka at gmail.com
> > Subject: SCN: RE: SCNA kaput -- irrevocably?
> >
> > I would hate to see SCN die totally.  I am not sure how many active
> > users
> > we still have but I do have 4 non profits with directories on SCN
> > that I
> > keep up.  I also still try to keep up the Spirituality menu.
> >
> > What would it mean to our users if your group took over Doug?
> >
> > What does the SCN Constitution and By-laws say about the disposition
> > of
> > assets if we were to dissolve SCN?
> >
> > Having gone though this with a church I do know that not much is
> > required
> > to reactive except for filing an up to date Constitution and By-laws
> > and
> > the fee.  At least that was all we had to do for the church.
> >
> > Is there anyone left who can call a meeting of the members to
> > approve any
> > actions?
> >
> > Lois
> >
> > Original Message:
> > -----------------
> > From: Douglas Schuler douglas at publicsphereproject.org
> > Date: Wed, 29 Jun 2011 21:07:36 -0700
> > To: randomgrace at gmail.com, alboss at sisypheans.org, al.boss at metrokc.gov,
> > kgillgren at igc.org, jj at scn.org, scn at scn.org, douglas at cpsr.org,
> > steve at advocate.net, jmabel at speakeasy.org, jimh at scn.org, ljbeedle at scn.org
> > ,
> > bb615 at scn.org, anamioka at gmail.com
> > Subject: SCNA kaput -- irrevocably?
> >
> >
> >
> > After 10 years or so of inaction it looks like the SCN board finally
> > ceased re-upping with the secretary of state.
> >
> > I'm guessing that it would still be possible to re-initiate the
> > organization if  anybody wanted to.  I'd be willing for the Public
> > Sphere Project (a non-profit,  501.c.3 organization) to  absorb the
> > assets (probably just the machine) to continue the operation of the
> > machine.  I  think that my students could  take  some  degree of
> > custodianship over  the machine as part of their civic  intelligence
> > work.
> >
> > -- Doug
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > --------------------------------------------------------------------
> > mail2web.com - What can On Demand Business Solutions do for you?
> > http://link.mail2web.com/Business/SharePoint
> >
> >
> > * * * * * * * * * * * * * *  From the Listowner  * * * * * * * * * *
> > * *
> > .       To unsubscribe from this list, send a message to:
> > majordomo at scn.org               In the body of the message, type:
> > unsubscribe scn
> > ==essages posted on this list are also available on the web at: =* *
> > * * * *
> > *     http://www.scn.org/volunteers/scn-l/     * * * * * * *
> >
> >
>
> Douglas Schuler
> douglas at publicsphereproject.org
>
> ------------------------------------------------------------------------------
> Public Sphere Project
>       http://www.publicsphereproject.org/
>
> Liberating Voices!  A Pattern Language for Communication Revolution
> (project)
>       http://www.publicsphereproject.org/patterns/
>
> Liberating Voices!  A Pattern Language for Communication Revolution
> (book)
>       http://mitpress.mit.edu/catalog/item/default.asp?ttype=2&tid=11601
>
>
>
>
>
* * * * * * * * * * * * * *  From the Listowner  * * * * * * * * * * * *
.	To unsubscribe from this list, send a message to:
majordomo at scn.org		In the body of the message, type:
unsubscribe scn
==== Messages posted on this list are also available on the web at: ====
* * * * * * *     http://www.scn.org/volunteers/scn-l/     * * * * * * *


From bb615 at scn.org  Thu Jun 30 15:17:35 2011
From: bb615 at scn.org (bb615 at scn.org)
Date: Thu, 30 Jun 2011 22:17:35 +0000 (UTC)
Subject: No subject
In-Reply-To: <20110630200858.01184BF7CD@scn.org>
References: <20110630200858.01184BF7CD@scn.org>
Message-ID: <alpine.NEB.2.00.1106302210070.14002@iceland.freeshell.org>

This message from Doug Schuler bounced from the scn list (from a
non-subscribed address).

Rod Clark

---------- Forwarded message ----------
Date: Thu, 30 Jun 2011 13:08:58 -0700 (PDT)
From: Douglas Schuler <douglas at publicsphereproject.org>
Cc: Steve Guest <steve at steve-guest.com>,
 	Lois Beedle <ljbeedle at scn.org>, Al Boss <alboss at sisypheans.org>,
 	Ken Gillgren <kgillgren at igc.org>, "J. Johnson" <jj at scn.org>,
 	scn <scn at scn.org>, Steve <steve at advocate.net>,
 	Joe Mabel <jmabel at speakeasy.org>, Jim Horton <jimh at scn.org>,
 	bb615 at scn.org, Aki <anamioka at gmail.com>, Joel Ware <jw4 at scn.org>,
 	"Joel Ware, IV" <joelware at yahoo.com>,
 	Ti Locke-Computer Giveaway <tgreyraven at yahoo.com>
To: Randy Groves <randomgrace at gmail.com>
Subject: Re: SCN: Re: RE: SCNA kaput -- irrevocably?


Randy et al,

I don't  feel like I'm dancing on SCN's grave. On the contrary I'm
interested in trying to help save it -- and to help identify new ways
in which it could address its mission and principles.

When I noticed that the paperwork hadn't been submitted with the state
(http://www.scn.org/commnet/scn-inactive.pdf) I assumed that the
organization had been abandoned.

And while I admit that I could be wrong it seems that very little has
been done with SCNA for several years and, as I've suggested in the
past, it might be good to establish different leadership.

Randy or others, please bring us up to date on the situation.

Thanks!

-- Doug
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From bb615 at scn.org  Thu Jun 30 15:10:01 2011
From: bb615 at scn.org (bb615 at scn.org)
Date: Thu, 30 Jun 2011 22:10:01 +0000 (UTC)
Subject: SCN: RE: RE: SCNA kaput -- irrevocably? - from Ken Gillgren
Message-ID: <alpine.NEB.2.00.1106302207330.14002@iceland.freeshell.org>

This mesage from Ken Gillgren bounced from the scn list (from a
non-subscribed address).

Rod Clark

---------- Forwarded message ----------
Date: Thu, 30 Jun 2011 12:44:22 -0700 (PDT)
From: "Kenneth" <kgillgren at igc.org>
To: "'Randy Groves'" <randomgrace at gmail.com>,
 	"'Steve Guest'" <steve at steve-guest.com>
Cc: <ljbeedle at scn.org>, <douglas at publicsphereproject.org>,
 	<alboss at sisypheans.org>, <al.boss at metrokc.gov>, <jj at scn.org>,
 	<scn at scn.org>, <douglas at cpsr.org>, <steve at advocate.net>,
 	<jmabel at speakeasy.org>, <jimh at scn.org>, <bb615 at scn.org>,
 	<anamioka at gmail.com>, "'Joel Ware, IV'" <jw4 at scn.org>,
 	"'Joel Ware, IV'" <joelware at yahoo.com>,
 	"'Ti Locke-Computer Giveaway'" <tgreyraven at yahoo.com>
Subject: RE: RE: SCNA kaput -- irrevocably?
Date: Thu, 30 Jun 2011 12:54:59 -0700

Out of curiousity, how many volunteer/technical staff are still supporting
SCN? I know the Wedgwood Community Council was hosted on SCN until the
council's Web admin was unable to get a response from SCN support (I don't
remember what the question or issue was anymore, this was probably 2-3 years
ago), and so they weighed anchor and moved to a commercially hosted service.

Are people still signing up for email addresses and/or mailing lists? Can
people still sign up for email addresses and/or mailing lists?

I'm guessing there could still be a niche for SCN, although the type of
support might be different, and therefore the volunteer pool may or may not
be available.

Just wondering.

Ken Gillgren
(206) 755-9578
  <mailto:ken at gillgrencommunication.com> ken at gillgrencommunication.com
Skype: ken.gillgren



   _____

From: Randy Groves [mailto:randomgrace at gmail.com]
Sent: Thursday, June 30, 2011 12:32 PM
To: Steve Guest
Cc: ljbeedle at scn.org; douglas at publicsphereproject.org;
alboss at sisypheans.org; al.boss at metrokc.gov; kgillgren at igc.org; jj at scn.org;
scn at scn.org; douglas at cpsr.org; steve at advocate.net; jmabel at speakeasy.org;
jimh at scn.org; bb615 at scn.org; anamioka at gmail.com; Joel Ware, IV; Joel Ware,
IV; Ti Locke-Computer Giveaway
Subject: Re: RE: SCNA kaput -- irrevocably?


I was a bit curious that Joel, Alan, and Ti were not included in the e-mail,
but forwarded it to them as soon as I saw it.

I think that it is a little early to start dancing on SCN's grave.

-randy


On Thu, Jun 30, 2011 at 12:16 PM, Steve Guest <steve at steve-guest.com> wrote:


Hi Lois
Having officially resigned from the SCNA board about 3 years ago I cannot
tell you the current situation.  I do not see Joel or Ti listed in this
email and they were still board members when I resigned.

As for the disposal of the SCNA assets and funds the articles of
incorporation, the constitution and the by-laws where appropriate were all
very clear - these must all go to CPSR.  Having tried to change a small
aspect of these by-laws to give the board the ability to perform a required
and expected management function - and failing - I would expect these asset
and fund dispersal requirements have not changed.  Therefore they cannot
simply be transferred to another non-profit.

The ACLU attorney who setup the rules did a great job.  I had discussions
with four attorneys on ways to change these documents, including the one who
did the original work.  There are copies of the documents on the web site
should you need them.  I would have your own legal counsel look at these.

Steve

Dr. Steve Guest
206-364-5636

-----Original Message-----
From: owner-scn at scn.org [mailto:owner-scn at scn.org] On Behalf Of
ljbeedle at scn.org
Sent: Thursday, June 30, 2011 2:34 AM
To: douglas at publicsphereproject.org; randomgrace at gmail.com;

alboss at sisypheans.org; al.boss at metrokc.gov; kgillgren at igc.org; jj at scn.org;
scn at scn.org; douglas at cpsr.org; steve at advocate.net; jmabel at speakeasy.org;

jimh at scn.org; bb615 at scn.org; anamioka at gmail.com
Subject: SCN: RE: SCNA kaput -- irrevocably?


I would hate to see SCN die totally.  I am not sure how many active users
we still have but I do have 4 non profits with directories on SCN that I
keep up.  I also still try to keep up the Spirituality menu.

What would it mean to our users if your group took over Doug?

What does the SCN Constitution and By-laws say about the disposition of
assets if we were to dissolve SCN?

Having gone though this with a church I do know that not much is required
to reactive except for filing an up to date Constitution and By-laws and
the fee.  At least that was all we had to do for the church.

Is there anyone left who can call a meeting of the members to approve any
actions?

Lois

Original Message:
-----------------
From: Douglas Schuler douglas at publicsphereproject.org
Date: Wed, 29 Jun 2011 21:07:36 -0700
To: randomgrace at gmail.com, alboss at sisypheans.org, al.boss at metrokc.gov,
kgillgren at igc.org, jj at scn.org, scn at scn.org, douglas at cpsr.org,
steve at advocate.net, jmabel at speakeasy.org, jimh at scn.org, ljbeedle at scn.org,
bb615 at scn.org, anamioka at gmail.com
Subject: SCNA kaput -- irrevocably?



After 10 years or so of inaction it looks like the SCN board finally
ceased re-upping with the secretary of state.

I'm guessing that it would still be possible to re-initiate the
organization if  anybody wanted to.  I'd be willing for the Public
Sphere Project (a non-profit,  501.c.3 organization) to  absorb the
assets (probably just the machine) to continue the operation of the
machine.  I  think that my students could  take  some  degree of
custodianship over  the machine as part of their civic  intelligence
work.

-- Doug
* * * * * * * * * * * * * *  From the Listowner  * * * * * * * * * * * *
.	To unsubscribe from this list, send a message to:
majordomo at scn.org		In the body of the message, type:
unsubscribe scn
==== Messages posted on this list are also available on the web at: ====
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From bb615 at scn.org  Thu Jun 30 15:07:25 2011
From: bb615 at scn.org (bb615 at scn.org)
Date: Thu, 30 Jun 2011 22:07:25 +0000 (UTC)
Subject: SCN: RE: RE: SCNA kaput -- irrevocably? - from Steve Guest
Message-ID: <alpine.NEB.2.00.1106302202300.14002@iceland.freeshell.org>

This message from Steve Guest bounced from the scn list (from a
non-subscribed address).

Rod Clark

---------- Forwarded message ----------
Date: Thu, 30 Jun 2011 12:05:19 -0700 (PDT)
From: "Steve Guest" <steve at steve-guest.com>
To: <ljbeedle at scn.org>, <douglas at publicsphereproject.org>,
 	<randomgrace at gmail.com>, <alboss at sisypheans.org>,
 	<al.boss at metrokc.gov>, <kgillgren at igc.org>, <jj at scn.org>,
 	<scn at scn.org>, <douglas at cpsr.org>, <steve at advocate.net>,
 	<jmabel at speakeasy.org>, <jimh at scn.org>, <bb615 at scn.org>,
 	<anamioka at gmail.com>
Cc: "'Joel Ware, IV'" <jw4 at scn.org>,
 	"'Joel Ware, IV'" <joelware at yahoo.com>,
 	"'Ti Locke-Computer Giveaway'" <tgreyraven at yahoo.com>
Subject: RE: RE: SCNA kaput -- irrevocably?
Date: Thu, 30 Jun 2011 12:16:03 -0700

Hi Lois
Having officially resigned from the SCNA board about 3 years ago I cannot
tell you the current situation.  I do not see Joel or Ti listed in this
email and they were still board members when I resigned.

As for the disposal of the SCNA assets and funds the articles of
incorporation, the constitution and the by-laws where appropriate were all
very clear - these must all go to CPSR.  Having tried to change a small
aspect of these by-laws to give the board the ability to perform a required
and expected management function - and failing - I would expect these asset
and fund dispersal requirements have not changed.  Therefore they cannot
simply be transferred to another non-profit.

The ACLU attorney who setup the rules did a great job.  I had discussions
with four attorneys on ways to change these documents, including the one who
did the original work.  There are copies of the documents on the web site
should you need them.  I would have your own legal counsel look at these.

Steve

Dr. Steve Guest
206-364-5636

-----Original Message-----
From: owner-scn at scn.org [mailto:owner-scn at scn.org] On Behalf Of
ljbeedle at scn.org
Sent: Thursday, June 30, 2011 2:34 AM
To: douglas at publicsphereproject.org; randomgrace at gmail.com;
alboss at sisypheans.org; al.boss at metrokc.gov; kgillgren at igc.org; jj at scn.org;
scn at scn.org; douglas at cpsr.org; steve at advocate.net; jmabel at speakeasy.org;
jimh at scn.org; bb615 at scn.org; anamioka at gmail.com
Subject: SCN: RE: SCNA kaput -- irrevocably?

I would hate to see SCN die totally.  I am not sure how many active users
we still have but I do have 4 non profits with directories on SCN that I
keep up.  I also still try to keep up the Spirituality menu.

What would it mean to our users if your group took over Doug?

What does the SCN Constitution and By-laws say about the disposition of
assets if we were to dissolve SCN?

Having gone though this with a church I do know that not much is required
to reactive except for filing an up to date Constitution and By-laws and
the fee.  At least that was all we had to do for the church.

Is there anyone left who can call a meeting of the members to approve any
actions?

Lois

Original Message:
-----------------
From: Douglas Schuler douglas at publicsphereproject.org
Date: Wed, 29 Jun 2011 21:07:36 -0700
To: randomgrace at gmail.com, alboss at sisypheans.org, al.boss at metrokc.gov,
kgillgren at igc.org, jj at scn.org, scn at scn.org, douglas at cpsr.org,
steve at advocate.net, jmabel at speakeasy.org, jimh at scn.org, ljbeedle at scn.org,
bb615 at scn.org, anamioka at gmail.com
Subject: SCNA kaput -- irrevocably?



After 10 years or so of inaction it looks like the SCN board finally
ceased re-upping with the secretary of state.

I'm guessing that it would still be possible to re-initiate the
organization if  anybody wanted to.  I'd be willing for the Public
Sphere Project (a non-profit,  501.c.3 organization) to  absorb the
assets (probably just the machine) to continue the operation of the
machine.  I  think that my students could  take  some  degree of
custodianship over  the machine as part of their civic  intelligence
work.

-- Doug
* * * * * * * * * * * * * *  From the Listowner  * * * * * * * * * * * *
.	To unsubscribe from this list, send a message to:
majordomo at scn.org		In the body of the message, type:
unsubscribe scn
==== Messages posted on this list are also available on the web at: ====
* * * * * * *     http://www.scn.org/volunteers/scn-l/     * * * * * * *