SCN: Update: SCN site redesign link
Joe Mabel
jmabel at speakeasy.org
Wed Feb 27 01:18:53 PST 2002
Precisely. STRONG opposition. But, for example, if 3/4 of the people want to
spend some money on office supplies and 1/4 would rather hold on do the cash for
a while,the office supplies will probably be bought. Maybe slightly less money
will belspent than if everyone fully agreed on the same course of action
(compromise producing a stronger consensus), but the group won't be paralysed,
unless one or more members in good standing consider this a serious error: e.g.
they believe that the expenditure at this time will interfere wiwpaying rent at
the end of the month.
Similarly (although this doesn't apply to the Quakers), a consensus group can
appoint one or more spokespeople who are authorized to speak on behalf of the
group and who are trusted to accurately represent the consensus opinion of the
group rather than to substitute their own personal opinion and represent it as
the group's view. For example, I have authority to speak for the Peace Heathens
with reference to the Crisis Resource Directory (http://www.scn.org/crisis) and
Vivian McPeak and Dominic Holden each have authority to make statements in the
group's name about Drug Policy. These positions as spokespeople are based on
years of experience and mutual trust and on a belief that these individuals have
a strong understanding of the group's consensus views in these areas. (Also that
whenhin doubt, we won't a't unilaterally).
Nonetheless, the group could revoke this delegation at any time. (However, I'll
add that we have never clarified what would happen if one or two individuals
wanted to revoke someone's spokespersonship: the issue has never arisen, and we
might well have a "constitutional crisis" if it did. The only times anyone's
spokespersonship was ever revoked, there was clear agreement by a
supermajority).
--------------------
Joe Mabel
On Wed, 27 Feb 2002, emailer1 wrote:
> Actually, Joe is partly correct. However, from my experience with the
> Quakers (Friends), strong opposition does amount to a veto, in a consensus
> environment.
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: Joe Mabel <jmabel at speakeasy.org>
> To: Doug Schuler <douglas at scn.org>
> Cc: patrick fisher <clariun at yahoo.com>; <scn at scn.org>; <design at eskimo.com>
> Sent: Tuesday, February 26, 2002 11:05 PM
> Subject: Re: SCN: Update: SCN site redesign link
>
>
> > I just want to address a very minor point here (but, I think, an important
> > misunderstanding: the meaning of "consensus". Consensus does not mean
> unanimity.
> > It means a preveailing opinion from which there is no strong dissent. Like
> many
> > words in the English language, its meaning is a bit fuzzy: certainly a
> unaimous
> > opinion is a consensus, but a consensus is not necessarily a unanimous
> opinion.
> >
> > I bring this up because it often leads to a misunderstanding of what it
> means
> > for an organizion to function "by consensus". For example, the Peace
> Heathens (a
> > group of which I am proud to be a member) function by consensus. T)is does
> not
> > mean that we only act when we have true unanimity. It means we need a
> solid
> > supermajority and no strong, principled disagreement. Any individual
> active
> > member may "throw a block", but we would never be able to function if
> someone
> > threw a block every time they thought the course of action was imperfect.
> >
> > --------------------
> > Joe Mabel
> >
> > On Tue, 26 Feb 2002, Doug Schuler wrote:
> >
> > >
> > > Hi, Patrick and everybody else...
> > >
> > > You won't be surprised (I guess) to learn that I don't like
> > > the new logos. I vote for a cleaned up version of the
> > > logo we've always had. I don't see any need for a new one and
> > > I'm not clear as to who authorized this in the first place.
> > >
> > > I don't like to criticize this generous
> > > pro bono work but I suppose it's necessary. The first one
> > > -- computers -- is generic and I don't like the color
> > > scheme. On my computer the computers and the label
> > > aren't centered (but that is minor). The second one looks
> > > like a warmed-over version of the city of Seattle's logo.
> > > The third I like because there is some funk in it and
> > > it hearkens to what I thought was our logo. I'd like to
> > > include the categories that we use instead of what
> > > was used in this version. I wouldn't want to use this
> > > *instead* of our current one; but as a supplement.
> > >
> > > I don't like the block letter version, simple or not. WHY
> > > change to *that*???
> > >
> > > What's wrong with the original logo? Yes, it's fuzzy, etc. so
> > > let's clean it up. Is that so difficult??
> > >
> > > The statement on the studio30 web page is curious: "Native American
> > > leaning on a sand dune, holding a palm tree is the consensus."
> > > Consensus?? Among whom? (consensus means that *everybody* agreed so I
> > > was wondering a bit where this info came from)
> > >
> > > And -- IO hate to be so critical but I find it hard to read the
> > > new "basic buttons."
> > >
> > > I question why this was even undertaken at all when there are so many
> > > other crucial issues with SCN.
> > >
> > > -- Doug
> > >
> > > ******************************************************************
> > > * SHAPING THE NETWORK SOCIETY *
> > > * Patterns for Participation, Action, and Change *
> > > * http://www.cpsr.org/conferences/diac02 *
> > > * Tomorrow's information and communication infrastructure *
> > > * is being shaped today. *
> > > * But by whom and to what ends? *
> > > * Questions: diac02-info at cpsr.org *
> > > ******************************************************************
> > >
> > >
> > > On Sun, 24 Feb 2002, patrick fisher wrote:
> > >
> > > > Folks,
> > > >
> > > > This past fall and winter, I worked with a web designer to come up
> > > > with a new look for SCN. I provided an idea for a style that was
> > > > simple and we used a couple of other sites as examples for what we
> > > > were looking for in a look for SCN. I'll reserve judgement on the
> > > > site which is located at:
> > > >
> > > > http://www.studio30.com/scn/scn_faq.html
> > > >
> > > > In that time, an SCN volunteer came up with a site design based on
> > > > the same parameters as those given to the web designer. This design
> > > > is right on the mark with what we were looking for. It is not
> > > > necessarily in its final form, but represents, as close as possible,
> > > > a direction we aimed for. This site is located at:
> > > >
> > > > http://www.scn.org/~lee/scntesta.html
> > > >
> > > > If you have comments, please direct them to webeditors at scn.org. We
> > > > will be discussing the site redesign at the general meeting on
> > > > Wednesday as well. I will have printouts available of both sites up
> > > > for consideration.
> > > >
> > > > Also, logos have not be finalized in any way. Your comments on the
> > > > logo ideas are welcome. The logo on the second site were designed by
> > > > a graphics designer I found, enlisted, and worked with to come up
> > > > with logo ideas.
> > > >
> > > > Thanks much,
> > > > Patrick
> > > >
> > > > =====
> > > > Webmaster
> > > > Seattle Community Network
> > > > http://www.scn.org
> > > > "Powering our communities with technology"
> > > >
> > > > __________________________________________________
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