SCN: Hello?

Joe Mabel jmabel at speakeasy.org
Tue Mar 26 23:14:59 PST 2002 

Again, I will assert that the solution to this is not to delete pages and break 
other people's links. Speaking as someone who maintains an online directory, 
that is a way to create more work for someone else than you save for yourself.  
It's fine to delete the entire contents of a  page and have it just say "the 
information you are seeking has been relocated 
to...<URL>" or "This page described a monthly meeting that no longer takes 
place. For information about <topic> see <URL>."  It's also fine (commendable 
even) to drop our own links to now-useless pages, which reduces the clutter from 
the point of view of users, although admittedly not from that of administrators. 
And it is simply commendable to get our content up to date.  However, anyone who 
has tried to link into the City of Seattle's site can tell you that it is a 
royal pain in the ass to try to link into a site where they keep restructuring.

--------------------
Joe Mabel

On Tue, 26 Mar 2002, patrick fisher wrote:

> Joe,
> 
> The clutter needs to be reduced. There can be a place for discontinued pages,
> information, which is what I think Jim is referring to. If it means breaking
> someone's link, then that is the way it has to be. 
> 
> My reasoning is this: We need to have as much valuable information as possible on
> SCN, which it has a great deal of. At the same time we need to balance that with
> usability.
> 
> The Volunteer Community page is under SCN Communities. The old HTML file is still
> there. However, I cleaned up the section. 
> 
> Okay, back to beating a dead horse (for the last time): I have gone in circles and
> circles looking for information on SCN, not only because of the multitude of links,
> and not only because of the volume of data, but also because there is a lot of
> information that is not pertinent. 
> 
> When you have a lot of information that is not pertinent, it makes the very valuable
> information worthless if people can't find it.
> 
> SCN is great. It deserves to be greater.
> 
> Thanks,
> Patrick
> 
> --- Joe Mabel <jmabel at speakeasy.org> wrote:
> > Where it is our own SCN content - meetings that don't take place, etc - we 
> > should update the content! However, I strongly believe that even a page devoted 
> > to a meeting that no longer takes place should be modified to say "this page 
> > used to describe a meeting ..." etc. rather than be deleted, or you break 
> > someone else's link.
> > 
> > Not sure what page you mean by "The Volunteer Community Page". Can you give a 
> > URL?
> > 
> > --------------------
> > Joe Mabel
> > 
> > On Tue, 26 Mar 2002, patrick fisher wrote:
> > 
> > > I can think of one example: The Volunteer Community Page had a lot of out of
> > date
> > > stuff: Event information that was 2 years after the fact.
> > > 
> > > Maybe by outdated, Jim means anachronistic? There is a lot of old stuff: Like
> > > information on meetings that don't take place anymore, email address galore for
> > > people who are no longer with the organization, procedures that don't occur now
> > and
> > > have been supplanted by something else. SCN services, many of which are not
> > > occuring. Training, anyone?
> > > 
> > > Gross generalizations, but that is what I see from my vantage point.
> > > 
> > > Patrick
> > > 
> > > --- Joe Mabel <jmabel at speakeasy.org> wrote:
> > > > So could you please elaborate (by example, or whatever) what you mean by 
> > > > outdated content?  For example, I have pages in the Crisis Resource Directory 
> > > > that haven't been touched in a year.  That's because I haven't had any new 
> > > > information in these categories. Does that make them irredeemably old? I sure 
> > > > don't think so.  On the other hand, a page announcing an event can become 
> > > > completely outdated mere weeks after it is originally posted, because tse
> > evenv 
> > > > is now past.
> > > > 
> > > > So what do you have in mind? And what exactly do you propose to do with the 
> > > > "outdated" pages?
> > > > 
> > > > --------------------
> > > > Joe Mabel
> > > > 
> > > > On Tue, 26 Mar 2002, Jim Loring wrote:
> > > > 
> > > > > Thanks Joe for responding.
> > > > > 
> > > > > You bring up some interesting points. While I don't consider older and/or
> > > > > previous pages "demoted" by being placed in an archive, it is of some
> > > > > importance to figure some way of determining what material is no longer
> > > > > current.
> > > > > 
> > > > > In a sense, merely updating links and adding and deleting notices changes
> > > > > the pages, and this has been one method of keeping SCN current. Yet this
> > > > > method may, by some, be inadequate for larger updates and modifications.
> > > > > 
> > > > > Interesting points, Joe.
> > > > > 
> > > > > -----Original Message-----
> > > > > From: Joe Mabel [mailto:jmabel at speakeasy.org]
> > > > > Sent: Tuesday, March 26, 2002 1:36 AM
> > > > > To: Jim Loring
> > > > > Cc: scn at scn.org
> > > > > Subject: Re: SCN: Hello?
> > > > > 
> > > > > 
> > > > > It's really hard to know what to think of this without knowing what you
> > > > > intend
> > > > > to demote to "archive" status.  How do you intend to decide that certain
> > > > > content
> > > > > is no longer current? I hope that in any case you don't plan to change its
> > > > > URLs:
> > > > > If you do so, you'll screw up any links to it that may exist.
> > > > > 
> > > > > That said, if there is actually any outdated content that deserves such
> > > > > demotion, it may well be a good idea.  But I, for one, would certainly want
> > > > > to
> > > > > know your criteria before I endorsed this.
> > > > > 
> > > > > --------------------
> > > > > Joe Mabel
> > > > > 
> > > > > On Tue, 26 Mar 2002, Jim Loring wrote:
> > > > > 
> > > > > > Hello All -
> > > > > >
> > > > > > Say, just thinking out loud, I was wondering how everyone felt about the
> > > > > > topic of directory simplification and the archiving old SCN material such
> > > > > as
> > > > > > web pages?
> > > > > >
> > > > > > It would be nice to simplify some of the directories as it might make it
> > > > > > easier for folks viewing SCN web pages to navigate and find information.
> > > > > It
> > > > > > would also be easier to edit the various sections.
> > > > > >
> > > > > > I think it would be interesting to archive some of the old web pages, and
> > > > > > make them available somewhere on SCN - a "Museum of SCN," if you will.
> > > > > >
> > > > > > Finally, we need to update some of the content on the pages, to keep SCN
> > > > > > useful and something folks might want to use as an up-to-date reference.
> > > > > >
> > > > > > So - ideas? We can chat about this at the SCN General meeting on
> > > > > Wednesday.
> > > > > >
> > > > > > Cheers!
> > > > > >
> > > > > > Jim Loring
> > > > > > webeditors at scn.org
> > > > > >
> > > > > > Seattle Community Network - "Powering Our Communities with Technology"
> > > > > >
> > > > > >
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> Seattle Community Network
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> "Powering our communities with technology"
> 
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