SCN: Re: your mail
patrick fisher
clariun at yahoo.com
Sun Mar 31 21:38:37 PST 2002
Doug,
I agree completely. I think we are both looking at the same thing, but as human
beings, and lacking the telepathy of ants, we often need to sort things out to
realize we speak of the same things.
Yes, social is very important. Social drives technology. Technology drive social
after the fact. Or maybe each drives the other.
We have the social, so we need to find out how to improve the social through
technology. We have home pages, we have mailing lists, we will soon have the Discus
(www.scn.org/discus/). Those are good sources of technology to provide for the
social aspects.
With that, perhaps I'm thinking mainly of the communication part of 'social'. I
presume you may be thinking of broader social aspects of technology.
Whatever the case, this topic is extremely interesting, and I know you will provide
an outlet for discussing such matters.
Please let me know when when to publish when the big events are going on with your
organization and I will spotlight them on our home page.
Thanks!
Patrick
--- Doug Schuler <douglas at scn.org> wrote:
>
> Thanks for your note Patrick.
>
> To me each statement in the principles suggests quite a number
> of possible things that SCN could do. I realize that limited
> resources (money, time, personel, etc.) doesn't allow us to
> do everything it could but I don't think that should prevent
> us from thinking creatively about new projects, etc.
>
> I do want to point out something in your note that I think
> I'd quibble with. YOu say, what "specific technologies
> do you suggest?" To me that's not quite the right question
> because it suggests that SCN addresses problems with
> technology alone. I hope that we never forget that SCN
> looks towards addressing things in ways that are SOCIAL +
> TECHNOLOGICAL! That is the only way that we could ever make
> any progess with our principles.
>
> -- Doug
>
> ******************************************************************
> * SHAPING THE NETWORK SOCIETY *
> * Patterns for Participation, Action, and Change *
> * http://www.cpsr.org/conferences/diac02 *
> * Tomorrow's information and communication infrastructure *
> * is being shaped today. *
> * But by whom and to what ends? *
> * Questions: diac02-info at cpsr.org *
> ******************************************************************
>
>
> On Sun, 31 Mar 2002, patrick fisher wrote:
>
> > Doug,
> >
> > Thank you for the feedback. Those are great principles, however what
> > specific technologies would you suggest for implementing those
> > principles? For instance, on the town halls idea, we will have Discus
> > discussion software up and running soon.
> >
> > And: As for providing access to information, does that mean to
> > continue with text dial-up service, or have PPP access like the
> > freenet in the Tampa Bay area? How about FTP access for all?
> >
> > I love the principles: They are very general, but they point in a
> > great direction. Kind of like our constitution: It is written on
> > principles, but laws are enacted to put those principles into action.
> >
> > Of course, we have a town hall forum with this mailing list. It works
> > great.
> >
> > Thanks,
> > Patrick
> >
> >
> >
> > --- Doug Schuler <douglas at scn.org> wrote:
> > >
> > > Patrick,
> > >
> > > Here is how I'd answer your question.
> > >
> > > I'd just think that we'd want to keep working on these commitmentss...
> > >
> > > Without in any way denigrating our past and current efforts
> > > I think we could go further (*much* further) than we have so
> > > far.
> > >
> > >
> > > Seattle Community Network
> > >
> > > Principles
> > > _________________________________________________________________
> > >
> > > The Seattle Community Network (SCN) is a free public-access
> > > computer network for exchanging and accessing information. Beyond
> > > that, however, it is a service conceived for community empowerment.
> > > Our principles are a series of commitments to help guide the
> > > ongoing development and management of the system for both the
> > > organizers and participating individuals and organizations.
> > >
> > > Commitment to Access
> > >
> > > Access to the SCN will be free to all
> > > * We will provide access to all groups of people particularly those
> > > without ready access to information technology.
> > > * We will provide access to people with diverse needs. This may
> > > include special-purpose interfaces.
> > > * We will make the SCN accessible from public places.
> > >
> > > Commitment to Service
> > >
> > > The SCN will offer reliable and responsive service
> > > * We will provide information that is timely and useful to the
> > > community.
> > > * We will provide access to databases and other services.
> > >
> > > Commitment to Democracy
> > >
> > > The SCN will promote participation in government and public
> > > dialogue
> > > * The community will be actively involved in the ongoing development
> > > of the SCN.
> > > * We will place high value in freedom of speech and expression and
> > > in the free exchange of ideas.
> > > * We will make every effort to ensure privacy of the system users.
> > > * We will support democratic use of electronic technology.
> > >
> > > Commitment to the World Community
> > >
> > > In addition to serving the local community, we will become part of
> > > the regional, national and international community
> > > * We will build a system that can serve as a model for other
> > > communities.
> > >
> > > Commitment to the Future
> > >
> > > We will continue to evolve and improve the SCN
> > > * We will explore the use of innovative applications such as
> > > electronic town halls for community governance, or electronic
> > > encyclopedias for enhanced access to information.
> > > * We will work with information providers and with groups involved
> > > in similar projects using other media.
> > > * We will solicit feedback on the technology as it is used, and make
> > > it as accessible and humane as possible.
> > >
> > >
> > > ******************************************************************
> > > * SHAPING THE NETWORK SOCIETY *
> > > * Patterns for Participation, Action, and Change *
> > > * http://www.cpsr.org/conferences/diac02 *
> > > * Tomorrow's information and communication infrastructure *
> > > * is being shaped today. *
> > > * But by whom and to what ends? *
> > > * Questions: diac02-info at cpsr.org *
> > > ******************************************************************
> > >
> > >
> > > On Sat, 30 Mar 2002, patrick fisher wrote:
> > >
> > > > Funny, no one has clarified, or even mentioned, what specific mission SCN
> could
> > > > have. Also, no one has mentioned what SCN lacks, or whatever, to reason why
> it
> > > may
> > > > partner elsewhere.
> > > >
> > > > I didn't intend to imply anything for SCN with mentioning other
> organizations.
> > > > However, I've been pretty clear about having low-cost or free internet
> access
> > > > similar to that offered by "regular" ISPs.
> > > >
> > > > This would mean something similar to the freenet in Tampa Bay, Floriday.
> They
> > > have
> > > > something good going.
> > > >
> > > > Patrick
> > > >
> > > > --- "J. Johnson" <jj at scn.org> wrote:
> > > > > On Thu, 28 Mar 2002, Doug Schuler wrote:
> > > > >
> > > > > > "Being" SCN doesn't mean staying exactly the way we are now!
> > > > >
> > > > > For sure. But would this experiment really be a success if it required
> > > > > changing our purposes, fundamental values, and every key element and
> > > > > characteristic--everything but the name plate--beyond all recognition?
> > > > >
> > > > > It seems to me that we should not be jumping onto some business model
> > > > > because it seems to be successful. Rather, we should inquire into what it
> > > > > takes to make _our_ model successful. Other examples can be illustrative,
> > > > > but each case is different, has different factors, and it can take a bit
> > > > > of careful study to tease out just what the correct lesson is. And as
> > > > > successful organizations often have no idea what makes them successful, it
> > > > > is necessary to also study unsuccessful organizations.
> > > > >
> > > > > === JJ =============================================================
> > > > >
> > > > >
> > > > >
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> > > >
> > > > =====
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> > > > Seattle Community Network
> > > > http://www.scn.org
> > > > "Powering our communities with technology"
> > > >
> > > > __________________________________________________
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> >
> > =====
> > Webmaster
> > Seattle Community Network
> > http://www.scn.org
> > "Powering our communities with technology"
> >
> > __________________________________________________
> > Do You Yahoo!?
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> >
>
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=====
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Seattle Community Network
http://www.scn.org
"Powering our communities with technology"
__________________________________________________
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